Seriously, which top manager would want to do Arsene’s job?

arsen-wenger_2409298b

The call for a change of manager at Arsenal is getting louder and louder, as more and more fellow Gooners feel that Arsene has no longer got what it takes to win us silverware. Arsenal are seventh in the table and trail the league leaders by 12 points, which is obviously very disappointing.

However, how much can Wenger be blamed for this and is replacing him the solution? And who would want to do Arsene’s job in the first place?

Wenger builds teams inductively: he has a general vision of the sort of football he wants to play and works hard with his players – often young or raw diamonds rather than established stars – to develop them slowly but steadily into a top-team. Arsene is fantastic at building teams bottom-upwards and his approach is a world away from the here and now – spend as much as you want – team gathering philosophies of the likes of Madrid, the Manchester Clubs, or Chelsea.

The one thing that is required, though, is not to sell the cream when it finally rises to the top.

Fabregas, Clichy, Song, van Judas should still be playing in our team, but, for various reasons, Wenger was not able/allowed to keep hold of them. As a result, Arsenal are in constant transition, and I doubt any manager could have put up with the amount of change Arsene had to deal with over the last few years.

The team that Arsene built around Fabregas had such great potential. If Cesc and Clichy had stayed and Arteta, Mertesacker and Gervinho had nevertheless still joined us, how much stronger would our team have been last season? The same goes for this season: if van Judas had not deserted us and Song had not been sold to Barcelona, and Podolski and Cazorla were still added to the team, how much better would we be doing now?!

Now, we could discuss forever whether the club could have prevented the sale of our finest players, or even whether Arsene himself is to blame for this to some extent, but the fact is they are gone and Arsene has to build a top-team once again. Obviously, this takes time and we, the supporters, whipped up into a continuous frenzy by the media, are unhappy with the lack of progress and not adding anymore silverware to the trophy cabinet recently.

At least in the short term, it looks like Arsenal will be unable to hold on to our top players easily; and I have little doubt that Walcott is the next one to be creamed away. Luckily, more funds are now available for Arsene to buy ready mate, experienced replacements, and some very good young players are starting to make their mark now as well. All is not lost, and it takes an experienced and patient manager to deal with the need to keep rebuilding, or at least adjusting, our team on a more or less constant basis.

Arsene Wenger

Other than Wenger, which top manager could work under these circumstances successfully; and moreover, who would be crazy enough to do it?

Jurgen Klopp, I hear you say. Maybe: he is no doubt talented and has had to deal himself with the loss of key players. But, in Germany he does not have to deal with two oil-financed clubs; his main competitor is the (naturally) mega-rich Bayern Munich, but he has been able to outfox them for the last two years – just like Arsene used to do in his early Arsenal career with Manchester United.

Klopp also has the luxury to replace the one or two players he looses every season from the rich, and yet affordable, German recruitment pool. At Arsenal, he would find himself under considerable more constraints, and pressure at the same time: I doubt he would want to swap with good old Arsene right now!

Pep Guardiola, is the other name that is shouted from the rooftops as the ideal replacement for Wenger. Why would he want to take over from Arsene? The first thing he is likely to ask for is assurances that nobody is sold unless he agrees to it. Just like Arsene, he would want to build a team around Wilshere, Ox, Theo, Szczesny, Miquel, Eisfeld, Cazorla, Giroud, Gibbs, Koscielny etc. He would also like significant funds to bring over a few more talented Spaniards. Would he get what he wants from the BoD? I doubt it very much. Guardiola is a man who can pick his next club out of almost anyone, and he would be daft to choose ours, given the constraints he would have to face.

I have heard other names: from Mourinho to the more top-club-inexperienced managers such as Moyes, or the latest hot-shot, Michael Laudrup. Mourinho is very unlikely to ever join a team again where he has to compete with limited means, and he also has very little staying power: definitely not the sort of manager to build the future of Arsenal around.

It would be best for us to realise that it is unlikely any of the top-managers would jump at the vacancy Arsene would leave behind. Furthermore, Chelsea, Liverpool and Spuds have shown us time and again that a change of management is more likely to make things worse than better.

A promising but unproven manager is far more likely to want to join Arsenal, and maybe they could do better than Arsene. But that is a big risk to take, and this could easily go horribly wrong. I do understand, though, that some fellow Gooners just want a change, as they are getting tired with Arsenal’s seasonal blips and all the associated negativity: and don’t we all?!

However, for me it is clear that Arsene is still the man for Arsenal. If I was his friend, I would tell him to jack it all in.

As an Arsenal supporter, I hope he’ll stay and somehow gets the best out of the predicament in which he has to operate, and by hook or by crook make us win silverware again.

Arsenal can change the manager, but for the time being, we are unlike to change our predicament. Best thing to do is to adjust our expectations a bit, and to keep giving Arsene our full and passionate support.

Total Arsenal.

This entry was posted in Uncategorized and tagged , . Bookmark the permalink.

80 Responses to Seriously, which top manager would want to do Arsene’s job?

  1. Peter says:

    Laudrup can do the job – has played on the highest level in the game, well respected, and he is an absolute gentleman. would like too see him at arsenal – we can hartly do worse than we are doing now.

  2. babakrdaemi says:

    I completely agree. Fergie, Jose, Pep, whoeever you like would have left under the conditions Arsene has had to work under. Arsene has even turned down holy grail jobs like Real Madrid for Arsenal.

    Top man,

  3. TotalArsenal says:

    Hi Peter,

    Agreed on your praise for Laudrup. He could easily do worse than Arsene. I know we take playing in the CL for granted now, but how hard are Spuds and Pool struggling to have a look in again? It could be us next.

  4. TotalArsenal says:

    So true, babakrdaemi!

  5. William says:

    No manager is indispensable.Results matter. If you don’t deliver the axe will fall.If i aint wrong ,Wenger is among the top three highest paid in the epl. To say no one willing to take over is condescending.The pay alone will attract top guys.
    The problem is tactically Wenger has lost it. He wants other teams to play his way. He doesn’t know or doesn’t want to know teams will play anti soccer to nick a win.Until he changes his philosphy with winning Arsenal will continue to struggl.e

  6. Jenkinson says:

    It’s amazing how much aggravation is being stirred up.
    Arsenal is sensibly run and successful.
    While the number one spot is unlikely, third is realistic.
    What on earth good is a march going to do?
    Maybe Arsene will get pissed off and depart – there are plenty of very attractive jobs for him out there. It won’t be the management that puts off any newcomers – it’ll be the fans. I honestly believe Arsenal has the worst fans of any club .
    Money doesn’t necessarily buy you success. Even ManCity are struggling in Europe.
    Chelsea finished out of the top four last season. OK they won the FA cup and won the Champions League with the same utterly dreary performance with which we won the Cup against ManU in 2005. So trophies aren’t everything.

  7. derek says:

    just remember folk – the bloke who brought us Arsene is not there……….the board’s last appointment was Bruce Rioch ! ! !

    ………..enuff said ???????

  8. TotalArsenal says:

    Hi William,

    Top pay is not a problem for a top manager – plenty of clubs are richer than ours / willing to pay as much as it takes.

    Why has Wenger suddenly lost it tactically? Anything you describe is not new – he just is building a new team again and it is proving to be more difficult at the moment. By Christmas things will look a lot better my friend. 🙂

  9. Stroud Green Road Boy says:

    A new manager wouldn’t necessarily do any better, however it would at the very least be a change from watching the same old mistakes being repeated again and again, both match to match and season to season. We’d get to watch new, different mistakes being made!

  10. TotalArsenal says:

    I can see where you are coming from SG. Sometimes a change feels good just for the sake of it, but I would not want to take the risk just now.

  11. TotalArsenal says:

    That’s right Jenks, third is possible and who knows what happens next. Agreed on many of your other statements. 🙂

  12. sleepinggiant says:

    This has got to stop. This is the sort of dangerous anti-Arsenal nonsense that is dividing the fanbase.

    Arsenal is a massive massive massive club with massive massive massive resources. I don’t have the figures in front of me, but I think they have something like the 6th biggest wage bill in Europe. Consistenly. And that is before the forthcoming cash injection. It is only headlines like yours which are in danger of creating a self-fulfilling prophecy and turning a massive globar empire into a minnow; If his sort of doomer nonsense is spread, maybe people will start believing it.

    So point 1 – Arsenal are a massively wealthy club with massive organically generated wealth that is poised to get bigger. How can you be negative about any manager wanting that job?

    The so-called ‘financial restraints’ you speak of are pretty much a self-imposed constraint by the manager. At every turn he talks up the self-sufficiency model as his own preferred choice – it is not a restraint. It is simply the result of a management and spending strategy. (The alternative explanation for his universal support of the policy is is unpalatable. Either that or he is a blatant liar and todaying yes man rolled into one. Backing the party line and afraid to take a stance. I prefer to think that this is unlikely). In either case, we have no idea if the board would free up money for another manager. Your approach is nothing short of scare mongering.

    So point number 2. The so-called financial restraints (such as they are – check the wage bill), may not even be cast in stone. They most certainly exist at the request of the manager, and you have no evidence to suggest that the owners might be flexible to the requests of a Pep Guardiola or Mourhino if they were put to them. So on top of the almost unprecadented organic wealth, there are vast reserves of cash in the hands of the owners if a new manager has the confidence and presuasive abilities to challenge them to invest it.

    A third point, and lets be honest, this is probably the most pertinent. Wenger gets a collosal salary for a manger who does not compete at the final stages of competitions any more(4th biggest in Europe I believe). It is logical to think that a new manager of the calibre that you have discussed would get more from the club. One of your commentors praises Wenger for not leaving Arsenal to join Bayern Munich or some other suitor. I would answer – why would anyone leave a secure job to take a pay cut for a less secure job elsewhere? The point is that Wenger’s successor is likely to be one of, if not the, most highly paid manager in Europe. All the talk is about the Guardiolas or Mourhino’s being worried about the money they could spend. However, the behaviour of football players, and indeed people in general, suggestgs that any prospective manager is more likely to look at his own salary and job security than at spending power. Given that Arsenal can demonstrably offer both (for the first see Wengers 16 year tenure in charge, for the second, see the vast wage bill that is about to be enhanced by the new commercial deals), it is an offence to the history of my great club to suggest we are not attractive to any manger.

    So there you have it. Arsenal can offer incredible wealth of its own making, with even greater cashpits swilling around in the background if the manger can back himself to make the owners part with it. They are a club that can spend all its huge self-generated wealth because they meet FFP regulations and offer both job security and reward to a manger. It is simply a matter of emphasising the positives. The rhetoric of the current manager over the past few years has been more suitable to a manager of a Charlton or Chelsea, not an Arsenal or Barcelone.

    I am not familiar with your website nor your views on the subject, but this nonsensical scaremongering is generally used by those strange individuals who are in love with the Arsenal manager, not the club. Apologies if this is not the case. But Arsenal is not Arsene Wenger. Whatever you think of him and the job he is doing it is an insult to this great club to try to protect his position by doing the club down.

  13. Stroud Green Road Boy says:

    I don’t see that it would be that much of a risk. Getting in the CL looks seriously in danger anyway, there seems to me to be as much chance, maybe even better, that any new manager could attain that 4th spot given the inconsistency of the teams around AFC. Even if they do not, AFC is financialy strong enough to keep going without it, plus we’re not going to win the thing anyway and we don’t buy players we couldn’t get without CL anyway. AW doesn’t seem to like modern football or dealing with the media, he’s addicted to the position and power he holds at AFC so doesn’t want to give up but I believe it’s become an unhealthy addiction for him.

  14. KaE says:

    at last, someone with some sense here.

  15. TotalArsenal says:

    Hi SleepingG

    I will ignore your first paragraph: you could not have said something more ridiculous. Of course, Arsenal is a massive club, but it has not got massive resources. It has to make ends meet every year, unlike the oilers who can make massive losses annually: we are not in that position, whether you like it or not.

    The maximum salary we are apparently currently paying is around £90k – and there were rumours Arsenal were prepared to pay van Judas up to £135k in a new deal. How is another top-manager going to deal with that current business fact of life my friend? Where would the money come from to buy the £35m+ deals and the £225k per week salaries?

  16. gee says:

    Peter are you serious

    Thats like comparing Freedy flintoff to Muhammed Ali.

    What next Ian Holloway or Harry Rednapp?

    Please!!!

  17. gee says:

    our away fans are one of the best though!!!

  18. gee says:

    I hear you on watching the same mistakes – but Charlton fans were fed up of finishing mid table in the prem – they only just got back to championship football last yr. Bet they all appreciate the job curbishley did now – Just dont want that to happen to us – know one is bigger than the club but Wenger is the most succesful manager we have had – the last one we had was Herbert Chapman and 50 yrs seperate them so be carefull what we wish for!

    Also being finacially strong to not need champions lg football can be attributed to the fact that wenger has got us that champions lg money for 16 yrs running!

  19. TotalArsenal says:

    Another one for you, SleepingG,

    Am I reading your comment right:
    ‘ The so-called financial restraints (such as they are – check the wage bill), may not even be cast in stone. They most certainly exist at the request of the manager, and you have no evidence to suggest that the owners might be flexible to the requests of a Pep Guardiola or Mourhino if they were put to them. So on top of the almost unprecadented organic wealth, there are vast reserves of cash in the hands of the owners if a new manager has the confidence and presuasive abilities to challenge them to invest it.’

    Are you saying it is Arsene who is not prepared to pay top players top wages in order for them to stay or come to Arsenal. Where is your evidence for that – talking about scaremongering?!

    The wage bill is relatively high because of the club’s investment in youth over the last eight years or so. Of course, this can be changed now but it will take time as players are under long-lasting contracts. However, to think we can compete with the continuously growing wage bills of the Oilers and even MU in the near future is a fantasy. Any new manager, would have to work under the same restraints, anything else is wishful thinking.

  20. the professor says:

    I honestly think that its time for Arsene Wenger to perform or go.I respect his past records at the club but that was 8 years ago we have to move on to greater things.I don’t care about the stats or facts the truth is he hasn’t won anything in 8years hell!!! Liverpool won a cup last season and their coach still got the boot .arsenal is bigger than arsene so its time to go mhen!!!

  21. TotalArsenal says:

    Hi Professor,

    So would you be a lot more happy if Arsene had picked up one or two League Cups, or even a FA-cup in the last seven years? I would not have made any difference to me.

    The harsh reality is that the Oil-funded clubs, and for now MU, are able to outspend us significantly on any player we would like to get, both in terms of purchase price as well as salary. Wenger has to fish for quality in the second pond and he does this very well. But the biggest problem is that Arsenal are not able to offer the £ 150-250k+ salaries at the moment, which will inevitably lead to departures of our top talents.

    Maybe the club should do everything to change this and maybe this will become easier now with the improvement on the income streams and reduction of costs from building the new ground. But Arsene has not been able to work under these conditions for a long time, and unless FFP will start to bite properly, the oil-rich clubs will always be able to simply offer more for and to a player.

  22. gee says:

    “The so-called ‘financial restraints’ you speak of are pretty much a self-imposed constraint by the manager.” – pretty sure we had debts of over 300million.

    “self-sufficiency model as his own preferred choice” – Dortmund model and the german bundeliga model has been talked up by clubs up and down the country as most clubs want to see a profit rather than making the banks richer

    “A third point, and lets be honest, this is probably the most pertinent. Wenger gets a collosal salary for a manger who does not compete at the final stages of competitions any more(4th biggest in Europe I believe). – he earned that salary (he didnt earn the same money when he first arrived) by winning the prem 3 x and going unbeaten, winning the FA cup a few times, get to the finals of UEFA and Champions lg and qualifying for champs lg for 16 yrs on the trott not many managers in the prem have that record so would expect to see him amongst the hihest earners.

    I cant be bothered going through the rest of your rant but its not factual and makes some absurd points based on logic – believe what you will

    “It is logical to think that a new manager of the calibre that you have discussed would get more from the club.”

  23. TotalArsenal says:

    Gee, I think he’s gone to sleep again. Ranting like that is very tiring 🙂

  24. sleepinggiant says:

    Totalarsenal – there is nothing ridiculous about the opening paragraph. This doing down of Arsenal has got to stop. End of.

    To take your points – firstly, I repeat Arsenal HAS massive resources, generated organically. They are not my figures, but there is reportedly 70 million sitting in the bank and that is on top of the unfeasibly collossal wage bill that is currently being misspent. That is not an issue with the clubs resources, just an issue of how they are (or are not) being spent.

    (Incidentally, as I am sure you well know Arsenal could just as easily operate at a loss as Man City or Chelsea IF IT SO CHOSE. There is nothing, repeat nothing to stop Arsenal taking cash injections from its owners in the same way that Man City and Chelsea do. The exact same mechanisms are available to Arsenal to inject external money into the club that are available to these other clubs and there is nothing whatsoever preventing us using them. Nothing except choice. Whether you like it or not, we ARE in a ‘position’ to do that. It is simply a matter of choice that we do not. Indeed, because of the massively superior financial situation of Arsenal to those clubs, it is actually a fact of commerical life that Arsenal are in a better poistion to run take a loss than these other clubs. That is if it so chose. If a new manager wanted to access this money, it would be to to him to persuade the owners that this was the way forward. We have no way of knowing at this point whether they would be so amenable)

    But that is an issue for another day and is getting away from the point. Even operating within the self sufficiency constraints voluntarily imposed by the clubs management and heirarchy, we still have massive resources.

    And thus on to your second point. I actually cannot believe that there are stil people asking questions like that. The Arsenal wage bill is massive. Absolutely massive. Its just the the distribution of the wages has been monumentally ballsed up by a man who, fair play to him at one level, decided to fly in the face of reason and attempt to create some kind of egalatarian paradise instead of a competitive dressing room. As you well know, a simple redistribution of the wage bill could easily resolve the insulting situation we are in where effectively we have to sell Van Persie to keep the likes of Squillachi happy. Again, this has nothing to do with the amount of money the club has, Merely the misguided way in which it has been distributed. You seem to imply that this is somehow irreversible, that the Wenger regime has destroyed the club into perpetuity with its mad wage policy. As contracts are finite, I will assure this is not the case. Sensible management of the clubs wages can oblitarate this problem in two years at most and make sure it never happens again.

    If you want me to spell it out as simply as I can, if two squad players like Squillacchi and Denilson were paid 30 grand a week less (leaving both on a still mindblowing 30 grand ffs), then immediately you have 60 grand extra for a Van Persie. End of crisis And before you say it, I am wall aware that you can’t just reduce their wages. That is not the point. The point is that the money is already there. It is not the lack of money at the club that is driving the players away. It is the amount of the wage bill that is going to crap players. In fairness it was a worthy ideal from Wenger, to try and pay everyone roughly equal, but a naieve one which as doomed to failure

    And I am certain that the first thing that a new manager, whoever he is, will do when he walks through the door is to impose a far more realistic and standard allocation of wages.

    And this, as I say, is based on the clubs current finances. Not on the increased money coming through in the future.

    Time for the excuses to stop. Time for all Arsenal fans to man up. We can’t hide behind frugality any more. We are spending fortunes. Just spending it badly. It is a lie to suggest that it is lack of money that is holding the club back. And as this article is about new managers, I have no doubt whatseover that the advisors of any new manger will be aware of that.

  25. sleepinggiant says:

    RE do I think that it is Wenger who is not prepared to pay top players top wages.

    Yup. I certainly do. its not that he is per se averse to it, he is averse to major discrepancies in wages. As we know (countless quotes from Gazidis and the man himself) Wenger decides how wages are spent. The sad truth is that, if Wenger had 200 grand to pay Messi and Squillacchi, instead of apportioning it 180 Grand to messi and 20 to Squillacchi (at best), iot would probably be 120 to 80.

    Wise up. If Wenger opposed this (assuming he has backbone) he would have walked long ago.

  26. TotalArsenal says:

    I rest my case, SG.

  27. TotalArsenal says:

    SG, I cannot accuse you of passion for the club, and not taking the time to explain your views. 🙂

    They are too simplistic in my opinion, and your in denial of the big financial picture. However, I need to be out for a while and will respond later in more detail.

  28. sleepinggiant says:

    Gee, My God you are so defensive of the manager. Repeat after me – Arsene is not Arsenal, Arsena is not Arsenal, Arsene is not Arsenal

    WE had debts of over 300million, almost 10 years ago. The debt is one part of the financial equation. I couldnt be bothered with going into all of the others suffice to say that, even within self sufficiency, we are paying massive wages and still sitting on massive cash reserves and turning a huge profit. The debt is relevant onlyin the context of the overall financial situation. I submit you are hiding behind old outdated excuses.

    “self-sufficiency model as his own preferred choice” – Dortmund model and the german bundeliga model has been talked up by clubs up and down the country as most clubs want to see a profit rather than making the banks richer.

    What is your point? We know the Bundesliga clubs like it. So does Wenger. The point is that it is obviously his choice to go down this road at our club. Which means it is his choice to be frugal with his money vis a vis how other English clubs may spend. Unless you thought I was implying that WEnger was the only advocate of this approach (which I am not) I dont know what your poin tis.

    Your point about WEngers salary shows exactly why I call you defensive. I am not saying Wenger has done a dreadfully bad job or doesnt in some way deserve his salay for his consistency on the whole. What I am saying is that one of the most attractive things about any new job is the salary on offer, Given that this article mentioned Guardiola Mourhino and Klopp, who like it or not are at the moment hotter prospects than Wenger, I was merely showing that the club are very likely to offer the new manager more than Wenger is currently getting. Certainly whoever gets the job is going to be very well paid, even compared to other top clubs Surely given that the club will be trying to attract the best available, there is nothing even remotely controversial in that?

  29. sleepinggiant says:

    Total…I must also head off now. And I will just counter by saying sometimes you can also overcomplicate things and it is possible to blind yourself to wood because you get confused by the trees.

    But enough of such things. Beat Swansea tomorrow and I’m sure we will all be happier.

    UP THE GUNNERS.

  30. Peter says:

    IMO we are underachiving at the moment with a fair squad – that is Wengers responsabiliaty… And although he in previous years have been able to put us in top 4 i dont see it happen again in this season – our perfomences are quite simple not good enough. For intance – in previous years when playing against utd, sir Alex has had the utmost respect for our midfield play and therefore played with 5 midfield players against us – this year no need for that. We were easily overpowered… We are in a decline…
    On the other hand Laudrup is making great results with less. He had to sell some of the profiles from last season but has bought great replacements rapidly. Think of what he could achive on a langer stage with larger budgets.. I for one would like to see that….

  31. Kanai says:

    Is it that AW doesn’t want success? Didn’t AW just mention his frustration about selling his best players? When he was to come there was this phrase ‘ARSENE what?’ The man came and for 16yrs no break in champions league qualification and for the last 13yrs we always qualify for the 2nd round. If AW is not good let him go and you will see how many clubs(I MEAN ELITE CLUBS) will rush to have him. I repeat this; should the board choose to spend like others arsenal will dominate the Epl and Europe for years. How many times have arsenal been written off? Year in and year out, yet we see the ‘school boys’ as some call them qualifying for CL every year. Calculate all man city have spent on players from the time the Arabs took over till date, rationalised their success vis-sa-vis what they have spent. 2 times CL qualification without even emerging from the group stages, 1 FA cup and 1 Epl title. What of PSG, MALAGA, ANZI etc?
    All we need are 2 to 3 players added to this sqaud and making sure we stop selling our top players.

  32. TotalArsenal says:

    Kanai, that is a fine comment. 🙂

  33. TotalArsenal says:

    Still busy SG, but I will respond to your 14.01 comment tonight.

    Let’s hope we beat Swansea and get the ball rolling again! 😛

  34. oz gunner says:

    Wow a lot of great comments on here today, look forward to reading them after.

    Spot on TA, he’s copped it and stuck around. No one else i’d rather see manage the club. Klopp in a few years maybe, but then their is the apprentice Bould if it’s down the track.

    The calls for Laudrup are ridiculous! A decent run with season and he’s the next big thing, what a joke!

    VCC here we go:

    Arsenal
    Fulham-Totts Draw
    Man U
    Newcastle
    West Brom

  35. Red Arse says:

    Hi TA, 🙂

    Unable to comment much today, but enjoyed the comments of others, especially Gee and Sleepinggiant.

    My reaction to what I read was that Gee seems a committed and balanced Gooner, even tho’ I am sure, like most of us, he probably has certain concerns with the current inconsistency?

    SG called you a doomer, which is so far from the truth it is obvious he does not know you.
    (actually, I have seen SG around and he usually seems knowledgeable and interesting).

    His lack of financial knowledge is understandable, as he clearly is not an accountant, and probably does not want to be one! 🙂 But his comments are weakened by relying on financial statements that are not true.
    I thought you might have referred him to my recent Post, as he might have found that informative.
    That Post looked at the financial impact of FFP on the EPL with regard to CL qualification, and the wish of most of the EPL chairmen to extend that to the whole of the EPL. That would explain why his point about Usmanov, or even Kroenke, injecting capital into Arsenal is sooooo early 21st Century. 😀

    We are currently in the initial stages of FFP and that prohibits such non commercial cash loans being made or converted into equity capital, and ensures that spending and salaries can only be conducted (incurred) by reference to a % of the club’s commercial turnover and its profitability.

    Usmanov/Kroenke would not now be allowed to inject £100’s of millions into Arsenal.
    That route is now history.

  36. Red Arse says:

    Hi Oz, 🙂

    I hope you are working on a rip roaring pre-match for us!! 😀

  37. gee says:

    “The so-called ‘financial restraints’ you speak of are pretty much a self-imposed constraint by the manager.” – pretty sure we had debts of over 300million.

    “self-sufficiency model as his own preferred choice” – Dortmund model and the german bundeliga model has been talked up by clubs up and down the country as most clubs want to see a profit rather than making the banks richer

    “A third point, and lets be honest, this is probably the most pertinent. Wenger gets a collosal salary for a manger who does not compete at the final stages of competitions any more(4th biggest in Europe I believe). – he earned that salary (he didnt earn the same money when he first arrived) by winning the prem 3 x and going unbeaten, winning the FA cup a few times, get to the finals of UEFA and Champions lg and qualifying for champs lg for 16 yrs on the trott not many managers in the prem have that record so would expect to see him amongst the hihest earners.

    I cant be bothered going through the rest of your rant but its not factual and makes some absurd points based on logic – believe what you will

    “It is logical to think that a new manager of the calibre that you have discussed would get more from the club.”

    “Gee, My God you are so defensive of the manager” – Cause i respect the achivements of the best manager we have had , also respect ALL arenal mangers down the line and appriciate the work they have done for the club – is that wrong?

    “The so-called ‘financial restraints’ you speak of are pretty much a self-imposed constraint by the manager.” – what about the stadium

    WE had debts of over 300million, almost 10 years ago. – are we still not in debt.

    we are paying massive wages and still sitting on massive cash reserves and turning a huge profit. – we finish in the top 4 every yr, of course we have to pay big wages with a squad full of internations. Also we turn a profit cause of wengers wheeling and dealing

    my points on self suffiency is that most clubs want it if they have not got sugar daddies footing the bill

    I finished work so im off but would like to repeat what i said earlier – your argument does not make much sense.

    Cheers

    have a great weekend

  38. gee says:

    “Gee, My God you are so defensive of the manager” – Cause i respect the achivements of the best manager we have had , also respect ALL arenal mangers down the line and appriciate the work they have done for the club – is that wrong?

    “The so-called ‘financial restraints’ you speak of are pretty much a self-imposed constraint by the manager.” – what about the stadium

    WE had debts of over 300million, almost 10 years ago. – are we still not in debt.

    we are paying massive wages and still sitting on massive cash reserves and turning a huge profit. – we finish in the top 4 every yr, of course we have to pay big wages with a squad full of internations. Also we turn a profit cause of wengers wheeling and dealing

    my points on self suffiency is that most clubs want it if they have not got sugar daddies footing the bill

    I finished work so im off but would like to repeat what i said earlier – your argument does not make much sense.

    Cheers

    have a great weekend

  39. TotalArsenal says:

    Thanks for the pre-match Oz. I will publish it tomorrow morning around 7.30 English time. 🙂

  40. TotalArsenal says:

    Afternoon RA 🙂

    Good to see you back here and thanks for responding to some of the finance related topics. I was planning to quote from your recent posts, but did not have the time this afternoon.

  41. TotalArsenal says:

    SleepingG,

    In principle you are right that the whole wage bill leaves room for manoeuvring salaries in such away that Arsenal could implement more wage disparity; and with that allowing a few players to be on top-top wages – similar to MU. It is currently working for them, where Rooney and van Judas are on a lot more than any of the other players. Whether that is a fair system and would work long-term remains to be seen.

    However, as you indicate yourself it will take time to free up money as the likes of Denilson, Bendtner, Squilaci etc will only move if they are offered the same wages. There is another risk with paying a few players £1m pound a month, and the rest significantly less: those on lesser wages will be unhappy and will also ask for pay increases as soon as they start doing well. The club than either has to increase the salary or run the risk of the player wanting to move on. The long-term risk of this is significant increase in the total wage bill or disgruntlement under the players.

    But Gazidis has said that the pay structure needs to be reviewed and more competitive salaries will need to be offered. Does that mean we can start competing full on with the Oilers, the Mancs and the likes of Madrid? I don’t think so, but hopefully it means we can keep hold of players easier/longer.

    The club have indeed cash reserves, and there is a view we should take a bit more risk in spending it. I would welcome the signing of a couple of star players (DM and RW, and an experienced GK would be lovely) and who knows what will happen in January.

    However, I don’t think we will be soon in a position like Chelsea who signed players for the value of £70m (and wopping big salaries) over the summer without getting any money back for players sold, or MC who made an eye-watering loss of £194m last year.

    More importantly, I cannot see the board letting the self-sufficiency model slip much if at all, and a new manager will have to work under those constraints. In the short term, this is likely to be very unappealing to a top-manager, as expectations (at least of the fans) are high and the competition is simply almost impossible to beat at the moment. The risk of losing our best players also remains a real threat. I cannot see a Guardiola, Klopp, Mourinho, etc wanting to work under those conditions, but maybe you are right and I am wrong.

    I enjoyed the debate with and you are always welcome to come back to Bergkampesque. We talk a lot about pure footie on here as well! 😛

  42. TotalArsenal says:

    He has finished RA, and it will come out tomorrow around 7.30ish. I can tell you it will be worth getting up for! 😀

  43. TotalArsenal says:

    Hi Gee, you made some fine, balanced comments today, and we hope to see you back on Bergkampesque again! 🙂

  44. Herb'sArmy says:

    Hi All, Redders hasn’t submitted his list for the weekend.
    We all acknowledge there is a problem that goes to the root of the club, but the lack of transparency and communication between the BoD and supporters means none of us really know.
    It can’t help having a majority shareholder that has no love or working knowledge of how Arsenal and English football operates.
    Under this regime, Mr Wenger has taken on far too much. David Dein was a huge loss, and whilst he would not be welcomed back by many, we have no-one currently at the club who is able to fill the void that he left. It is a sorry state of affairs that at one of the world’s most famous football clubs, all the attention is focused on our resources, and the detrimental effect it has created within the club and its supporters.

  45. TotalArsenal says:

    Evening Herb 🙂

    Agreed that some of Dein’s skills have not been replaced and you can see how he and Arsene were the perfect football management couple.

  46. VCC says:

    OVERALL NOVEMBER SCORES

    Red Arse 6
    Rocky 6
    VCC 6

    Total 5
    Henry 5

    TMHT 4
    OZ 4

    GLiC 3

    Herb 2

    Joint winners and wearers of the Yellow jersey for November RA + VCC+ Rocky.

    Carrier of the wooden spoon for November Herb.

    Good luck in December lads, hope Santa brings you all what you want.

    ps. Still waiting for Rocky and Red Arse predictions for 1st December, 2012.

  47. TotalArsenal says:

    Haha Rocky obviously now believes that taking a long time will bring him luck hahaha 😛

    And RA is still doing all the maths on the odds hahaha! 😀

  48. VCC says:

    Odds for this week ends predictions…..

    GLiC = 687-1
    VCC = 65-1
    Total = 87-1
    TMHT = 20-1
    Herb = 22-1
    Henry = 33-1
    OZ = 31-1

  49. TotalArsenal says:

    Wow, great odds for Terry and Herbivore!

  50. glic says:

    Evening Penirschnitzel`s 😆

    A cage rattling post Total !.

    AW drives me mad, but then again so do a lot of people I love !. I`m still with them though.

    Take away the City and Chav cash over the last few years and we most certainly would have won a Title/trophy or more. To keep us in the CL since the other lot arrived has been Top Management, especially with a Stadium move and the constraints it has led too.
    I feel as though Arsene deserves the chance of leading/guiding us in the future level playing field .
    Lets see how Mancini and whoever the Chavs manager is, manage with the constraints AW has had !. Would they get or have got 15 years of CL ?, my answer to that is, hahahahahahaha. With all that money one of them still cant get out of the group stage 2 years on the trot !.
    If AW walked out tomorrow, we would be in shit street, simple as that !. It`s bad enough the shit hitting the fan, but a street load of it ! , no thanks !. hahaha

    Just a point on the “deadwood”, they could be got ridden of, if Arsenal were to just let them go for nothing. We would immediately save wages and the club attracting them could pay them higher wages against no purchase price, I think Redders has said this before !.

  51. glic says:

    687-1 mmmm I might have a pasty on it !.
    I think we should have a side leader board for the highest odds obtained, I must be in the lead, LOSERS !. hahaha

  52. VCC says:

    GLiC…you’ll do anything to be a winner. he he he (henry) but unfortunately in the 1 UMF League your a loser. ho ho ho.

  53. VCC says:

    Total….you need to go to Spec savers….GLiC has the best odds. Probably have the wooden spoon on Saturday evening too.

  54. VCC says:

    GLiC…..I suppose all in all, your about right. If the oily money wern’t involved, Wenger would have definitely won something these past 7 tears. Good point.

  55. TotalArsenal says:

    Hi Glic, Re the ‘deadwood’ – you are assuming that other clubs would want to pay the same or higher wages for the likes of Denilson, Bendtner, Squilaci etc, even if they don’t need to pay our club for them. I don’t think this is the case for most of the deadwooders…

  56. TotalArsenal says:

    Past seven tears – brilliant ‘mistake’! 😛

  57. glic says:

    Total, I dont think any of them would get higher wages !. hahaha

    I wonder who is paying Bendy`s and Denilson`s wages at the moment ?. Is it half and half by the borrowers and lenders ?.

  58. TotalArsenal says:

    Glic, btw your 19.49 was a really sharp, as in to the point, comment. 🙂

    I reckon Arsenal still pay towards their wages but not sure what sort of percentage.

    How far are you now with the love shag. I bet Terry will be your first guest! 😀

  59. Herb'sArmy says:

    Hi Total, Dein’s role at the club was pivotal because it allowed Mr Wenger to concentrate solely on football.
    I know it probably wasn’t the manager’s decision, but Emirates are an Airline Co., not a name that befits a football theatre such as ours. I have grudgingly accepted we had to move for our brand to grow globally, but surely we could use some imagination with naming our new home. The New Highbury, or Highbury Park? You won’t see MU or Liverpool giving up the naming rights on their stadia any time soon, because they are more connected to their supporters and their shared history. So much Arsenal history belongs to Highbury, yet these days that club is barely recognisable.
    Anyway, the UMF 1 League is living proof that I know absolutely nothing about football.

  60. glic says:

    The Love Shack is slow going Total. I was put back by the weather and fixing the septic tank. The water table has gone down and the holes dug for the concrete slabs are clear. I had twenty bags of cement and two tons of ” three quarter to dust ” delivered today and hope to do the 12 slabs/footing`s done by Monday !. I`ll then be onto the timber framer for a starting date !.
    It better be done before the end of Febuary as my son has ordered his furniture to be delivered by then !
    Actually it`s about 5 years ahead of schedule, so I`m not too fazed !.
    I had my digger driver do the lazer levelling of the 12 holes and he hadn`t seen the project since he did the digging out of the land. He was shocked to see my stone wall and flight of steps leading down to it. I was chuffed when he said the work that I had done would put most builders he worked with to shame !. It`s the second decent comment in a week, my nieces partner (who is a farmer) propositioned me to go into landscaping with him buying all the equipment ( tipper truck , digger etc` ) and me doing all the design work and him as the labourer !. I just want an easy life though ,it`s too much like hard work !. hahaha

  61. glic says:

    That makes two of us Herb !. hahaha
    I`ve got you in my reversing mirror !. hahaha

  62. VCC says:

    Whose a clever boy then.

    Take photos as you progress through the project. Put some up on here occasionally.

    You might be able to rent it out to Terry.

  63. glic says:

    I dont know Herb. Do you reckon the bin dippers would turn down say £200m for the naming rights of a new stadium away from Anfield or even regenerating Anfield ?. Remember they have American owners who have bought to make money, it`s not a play toy like Abramovich has !.

  64. glic says:

    I`ve got photo`s on my computer VCC, but haven`t a clue how to put them on site !. Cant seem to copy and paste them !. It will be quicker for you to pop around on your mobility scooter and have a look !. A13 > M25 > M4 > M5 > A30 > A388, you`ll be here in no time !. hahaha

  65. glic says:

    “Being in deep shit is best served with a wooden spoon”. ArisTotal AD 2012

  66. Herb'sArmy says:

    Hi GliC, J.W.Henry seems more in tune with the Liverpool fans, a lot moreso thank our own American cousin, Mr Kroenke. They’ve had plans accepted to increase their capacity to 60,000 and because of their European record they are a stellar comodity for commercial streaming. They have a much bigger and better reputation throughout the world than we do. And they still attract world-class players like Suarez, which we simply refuse to do.

  67. TotalArsenal says:

    Hi Herb, I had a feeling Dein was very streetwise and somebody who knew exactly how to make a player feel wanted by a club. I used to work with guy in the rail business who had exactly those qualities/personality as Dein does, and it always amazed me how much he got done by people, and how much new business he was able to add to the company. Although, I don’t know the detail, I would not be surprised if Dennis decided to join Arsenal as a result of Dein persuasive skills.

    I agree with you on the naming of the stadium – as much as I can I call it Ashburton Grove.

  68. TotalArsenal says:

    Glic, you are obviously a man with many qualities, and it is not all down to that mirror you hold in front of you constantly. 🙂

    Just a shame your a softy when it comes to watching footie 😛

  69. TotalArsenal says:

    A friend of mine just picked up a copy of the ‘Chelsea FC Official Calender 2013’. It’s got a different manager for every month! 😛

  70. Herb'sArmy says:

    And for anyone who really doesn’t understand the fundamental message of ‘We Want Our Arsenal Back’, it is die-hard passionate Arsenal supporters pleading for their football traditions to be sacred and upheld. Fans have never demanded £20m or £30m signings, but they are entitled to a club that dares to compete. Professional footballers who feel pain and misery in defeat, defenders who take it as a personal insult if they concede, a do-or-die attitude among the whole squad.
    People are bored with the lethargy at Arsenal, the lack of urgency, the whole chemistry is flat. We have players on stupid wages, we have carried passengers for six years, and continue to do so. Worst of all, the football has become slow, predictable, boring, and too easy for other managers to counter.
    Supporters may come to embrace ‘The Emirates’ in time, but what they want back is The Arsenal that was associated with Highbury and all the traditions that came with that. If people don’t understand that they don’t fully appreciate the great institution that is The Arsenal.

  71. TotalArsenal says:

    Well Herb, after the Everton game, they do not need to doubt the players any more. Get behind the team I say and fight with them rather than against them.

  72. TotalArsenal says:

    Final message: Oz’s pre-match report will come out around 7.30 – if you are a regular you might find yourself name-checked 😀

  73. Herb'sArmy says:

    It’s a two-way street, Total. If and when players show the same passion for the club that supporters do, the supporters will take them to their hearts, that’s how football works.
    Some say the EPL is the best league in the world, but I don’t agree. The title is contested between only two or three clubs, two or three clubs challenge for 4th, three or four chase the Europa Lge place(s), the rest scramble to stay up. A lot of good football has been lost to the overall fear of losing such is the thirst of bored over-payed hack’s to magnify every defeat into a catastrophic crisis. And grounds are so quiet, with only an occasional pause for a bit of noise.
    We could do a lot worse than adopt the Bundesliga model, because every time I watch the highlights on ITV 4, their stadiums are bouncing with passionate, appreciative fans. And at the end of the game the whole team acknowledge their supporters. It is a far more vibrant exciting product than the EPL.

  74. jnyc says:

    TA,you still write my favorite articles. I am a Klopp fan. I think he could see England as a step up, especially with an Arsenal resurgence, if our talent pool and finances look good at the time. He can maybe lure some of his current players to join as a challenge. We can offer top mgr salary, because we r used to paying Arsene top dollar already. He seems a class act, right style for a project, as long as we stay competetive at the time. A fall from top four can hurt alot in all recruiting.

  75. oz gunner says:

    Just read your post from the other day RA, top notch as expected! You and terry explained it really well. It isn’t fair, if i was supporting a lower team I’d be protesting, but I support Arsenal so all i want to see is the super spenders to be brought down to a reasonable level.

    I thought FFP was working slowly (Terry told me it was haha) but after seeing Chelsea in the last window I’m not so sure.

    I’m just glad for every City or PSG there is a Montpellier or a Swansea fighting the good fight! There is still hope in football

  76. oz gunner says:

    I agree JNYC, he’d be my choice for sure. He’s worked wonders at BD and plays the pressure game I’d love to see at Arsenal. Also if he could have a word to the following as he departs It’d be greatly appreciated:

    Goetze
    Reus
    Lewandowski
    Hummels
    Bender

  77. TotalArsenal says:

    Alarm clock did not go off, so new post will come out in about 15 minutes. Apols for the delay! 🙂

  78. TotalArsenal says:

    No need to buy a newspaper today!

    Oz has covered it all in a 2500+ words epic pre-match!

    NEW POST – NEW POST!!

  79. TotalArsenal says:

    Thanks Johnnie 🙂

    Klopp would be an interesting option if Arsene were to leave. I seriously doubt whether he would want to leave Dortmund in the next few years. He is building something up there that could become special, and as he is only young, there is no rush to jump ship now. In a way, I would rate that about him.

Leave a Reply

Fill in your details below or click an icon to log in:

WordPress.com Logo

You are commenting using your WordPress.com account. Log Out / Change )

Twitter picture

You are commenting using your Twitter account. Log Out / Change )

Facebook photo

You are commenting using your Facebook account. Log Out / Change )

Google+ photo

You are commenting using your Google+ account. Log Out / Change )

Connecting to %s