Is it loyalty or money that keeps Arsene at Arsenal?


There are many fellow Gooners out there who believe that Arsene has an easy job; that he has absolutely no pressure put on him by the BoD, and is paid vast sums of money whilst constantly underperforming. They have picked up a rumour from one of the blogs or newspapers that he is being paid more than Red Nose, somewhere in the region of £7m.

I have no doubt Arsene is generously remunerated by the club. His salary, whatever it is exactly, will be a reflection of him having been our manager for so many years. It will also reflect market value; as in what others – like the Spanish giants – would be prepared to pay in order to entice our manager to their club, and it will also mirror the club’s attempt to keeping Arsene at Arsenal throughout the difficult period of building the new stadium, and beyond.

You might strongly believe that Arsene has not been worth his assumed mega salary, as he failed to bring in silverware for eight years and counting, but the BoD are likely to have a totally different view. They are more likely to look at the wider picture, and will regard Wenger as a fine and  loyal captain who guided the new Arsenal ship through some stormy seas. In the process, he ensured CL qualification year in and year out, and did not require additional funds for player purchases to achieve it.

The club will have made a ‘Strengths, Weaknesses, Opportunities and Threats’ (SWOT) analysis during the periods of before, during, and after the build of the new stadium, and will have done the same  for the direct competition. I have no doubt that based on these SWOT analyses, the BoD will have concluded every time that Arsene did relatively very well. There will have been  hope rather than expectation for silverware over the last eight years, and only now will Arsenal enter a period in which it will be able to become a reasonably strong competitor for the top prices again; and hope is very likely to turn once again into expectation as a result.

This optimism is based on both a better financial position going forward and the likely, or should that be hoped for, impact of Financial Fair Play on the mega-rich clubs, who have been able to operate with enormous losses over the last 4-8 years.

It all remains to be seen whether Arsene is the right manager to guide Arsenal to silverware in this new era, and whether he actually still wants to do it.

Looking at him over the last few months and seeing all the abuse he has had to put up with, I wonder why he just does not call it a day. He could go anywhere; I am sure both Madrid and Barcelona will have vacancies this summer, or he could take a national manager job and take a team to Brazil. He could also just take a break from it all and spend time with his family: life could be so easy for him.

I don’t know Arsene personally but he does not strike me as a person who values money very highly, or somebody who wants an easy job either. Managing Arsenal during and after the building of the new stadium has been anything but easy. Yes, he was paid a lot of money in the process, and no doubt he was offered more job security than most football managers across Europe, but staying at Arsenal, during what is most probably going to be his best remaining years as a manager, was not the easy option.

What would he have lost, had he gone to Madrid or Milan, or Bayern, or Barcelona, or the French National Team, or anywhere else, say in 2006? Even if he had been sacked after a season for not winning anything, or for whatever reason, he would always have had his fantastic record with Arsenal, and found a new job again in no time.

Arsene clearly does not have to work for money anymore. He stayed at Arsenal, and is also now not prepared to leave, for another reason: partly because he is a very loyal person, who, in an old fashioned sort of way, wants to honour his contract every time, and partly because he is an ambitious man who wants to finish on a high and return Arsenal back to the very top, and with beautiful football in the process.

I am not sure anymore whether he is capable of doing this once more with Arsenal, but what I am sure about is his loyalty, ambition and passion for the club as his main drivers for staying put at Arsenal, and that money has very little to do with it.

And for that alone we should always respect him.

Written by: TotalArsenal.

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59 Responses to Is it loyalty or money that keeps Arsene at Arsenal?

  1. Danish Gooner says:

    It shouldnt matter how loyal you are unless you are successful.What good do Arsenal have at paying Arsene 7,5 mil a year when his team and himself keeps underperforming,it is ridicilous.No one is accountable at Arsenal it is just a fat gravy train for underperfoming ceos ,players and managers.Do you really think Arsene would get this kind of bumper salary anywhere else if he kept underperforming like he does?? It would be mad to pay a second rate manager this kind of money.Arsene should be at 3 or 4 mil a year and the rest bonus related but hey lets just throw money out the window at 9 mil we could get Mourinho and as you have just seen a tactical genius,taking Arbeloa off as sson as Nani got sent off,absolutely spot on or Arbeloa would have been tne next to walk,something Arsene would never have done.Arsene is riding the gravy train till at least 14,lets see then how much further he will ride(God forbid they renew his contract)

  2. afc says:

    Of course Wenger is a loyal manager. He sees Arsenal as a lifetime project and has invested his experties and time into our football club. I doubt there would be many other managers that would do that. I think all these years we have been in debt from the stadium and that is the reason why a lot of our best players have been sold is because maybe the board decides whether a player leaves the club or stays at the club and it is Wengers job to get the highest fee for him. I find this because Wenger liked Song as a player and within days of speculation of Song leaving Arsenal he was gone. Arsene probably did not even want to sell him. Yet he remains loyal to the board and does not publically expose the like other managers would. He puts on a brave face so that Arsenal do not appear weak to other football clubs as he does not want to see damage done to Arsenal. You see this even when he defends his players when they have performed so poorly I.e. Santos. After the Real match today Mourinho said the better team lost. What loyalty is that to the club or players. Wenger has overachieved with the position he has been in and could have taken the easy route out and left for a club like Real with a team he could easily win trophies with, but he wants to stay at Arsenal to stop them becoming a mid table team like Liverpool. If Wenger swapped teams with Mancini, Mourinho and Ferguson none of them would be able to improve the current position Arsenal and would probably end up doing worse than Wenger are in and if Wenger went to Real and especially City he would be winning more trophies at these clubs than Mourinho and Mancini has. Mancini could not even get his team out of the CL group stages and is not even going to win the league. Mancini has spent God knows how much money on transfers compared to Wenger. Wenger could easily go to City and turn them into European greats. We should be thanking Wenger for all of his hard work and determination. It is not easy being the manager of Arsenal. Fergie wants a striker the board give him 24 mil to spend on an injury prone 29 year old in the final year of his contract. I guarantee that is Messi was available for 50 mil and wanted to come to Arsenal tomorrow our board would not sanction the move. Kroenke is tight. All the other owners inject money into their clubs yet Kroenke keeps taking money away from our club.

  3. TotalArsenal says:

    The point is, Danish, that in your eyes he might be underperforming, but those in charge believe he has RELATIVELY done very well during the last eight years. And if you would be able to put yourself in their shoes, and to see the wider picture, you would no doubt agree with them.

    Arsenal are entering now a more stable and financially promising period, and success should be measured differently going forward.

  4. TotalArsenal says:

    Hi AFC,

    Fine, feisty comment my friend, and mostly agreed. 🙂

    Maureen made a real fool of himself today in front of the cameras, but nothing new there!

  5. afc says:

    Hi TotalArsenal, good article as usual and I enjoyed reading it like I enjoyed Van Judas and Man U getting booted out of the CL. I was watching the match with my brother who is a United fan. When Nani got sent off and Ferguson looked like he wanted to punch someone in the face I was smiling, when Ronaldo scored that second goal I jumped for joy and when Ferdinand and Fergie were pissed after the match I could not stop laughing. Man U finally got what was coming to them.

  6. Highbury Harmony says:


    Another well written gem by yourself on BK, congrats!

    I wholeheartedly agree with you and I’m so happy that you are balanced in your perspective. You see hope for our club in the future with AW at the helm and yet you understand that perhaps AW may not be able to win us silverware again.

    I believe it is a combination of passion, job security and of course remuneration. While I don’t believe it’s a main driving factor in his decision to stay at Arsenal, you can’t ignore it as a contributor since any individual also keeps their family in mind.

    However, it would be crazy to suggest that he is ONLY motivated by greed. He is so passionate about this club and would never do anything to harm us. He has stayed because of his loyalty to the club and his contract and he wants to see his vision eventually come to fruition. Do people honestly think he would not have made more money at Real? His passion is evident during every game, interview, comments by current and past players and the respect that other in the league and around the world give him.

    Perhaps AW has taken us as far as he can, but that does not diminish the fact that he ushered in a new era for us where we fielded imo the best team ever, stood by us in difficult times and did not abandon us for greener pastures when he had to work with considerably less.

  7. OMGArsenal says:

    Despite you writing a very balanced and perceptive article, there are still ignoramuses who come on and spite Arsene, based on nothing more than rumours, media speculation, spoilt entitlement hissy fits and delusions of their importance. In response to you morons who repeat the same fallacies and BS like the impoverished moaners you really are, here are a few real world facts about Wenger:

    1) Nobody knows his real salary but it has been confirmed by quite a few good sites like UA and LadyArse, that SAF earns more on shares, Publicity and bonuses, special deals and other benefits plus his salary, than Wenger could, since AFC don’t pay dividends.

    2) Wenger is already a millionnaire and doesn’t need a great deal more to be secure in r etirement. He does what he does out of love for the game and the ARsenal…something you whiny brats could learn a thing or two about!

  8. Alan says:

    Our judgement on wenger going forward should, as far as possible be made precisely on that basis, ie “going forward” , not looking back. And it has become obvious that he has lost the plot. He is incapable of recognising the need to build a team with real spine and spirit, to look at why and how he achieved what he did in his first few years at arsenal, and then without outspending anyone else. He is no longer a winner and that became obvious to me two or three seasons ago when we were on for the quad and he failed to invest a little in that January transfer window to take us over the line. We have no world class keeper, no leader in central defence, no serious holding midfielder and lack a serious central striker. It’s gross neglect and he should go. The sooner the better.

  9. oz gunner says:

    very well said TA. A voice of reason as always.

    Good comment as well HH, both bang on the money

  10. Highbury Harmony says:

    oz, do you think we have a good chance of finishing top 4 this term? also, how do you feel of our chances of grabbing 3 away goals at the Allianz arena next Wednesday :)?

  11. oz gunner says:

    @ HH

    It’s never good asking me those sorts of questions because I always go in to every season thinking we are going to win the lot (Too much TMHT ‘ghost of the 30’s’ cool-aide I think 🙂 )

    With our run home I think we have every chance to finish top 4. If the players dig deep I definitely think we can. If we just go through the motions for the remainder I’ll be bitterly disappointed to be honest. If you can’t lift another gear in moments like this when can you. The writing really is on the wall for the players. They haven’t performed well consistently so it is up to them to give us supporters something to be happy about by seasons end.

    In all honestly it is going to be almost impossible. Especially with their defensive record this season and our inability to score (especially away from home!) We gave it a good crack against Milan last season so hopefully we can deliver the same sort of effort. I don’t care if we lose 8-6 just as long we can see we gave it everything we had! It’s last chance saloon so let’s go for broke! It’s just annoying its bayern! They are so well drilled and I don’t think pressure will affect them that much.

    How do you feel on both issues?

  12. Highbury Harmony says:


    The only thing I’m concerned about is the carry over after inevitably being knocked out by Bayern of the CL. It’ll be extremely deflating for the squad to lose two big games back to back. However, anything’s possible and who really knows what will happen! Also, I concur that if we lose, so long as we leave everything on the field and knock in some goals, I will not be disappointed whatsoever. I’m hoping we play a wide open, flowing, attacking game and do not hold back much like yourself; no more of this ball possession and no quality chances!

    I must also say that I’m pretty positive of our chances to finish top four, mainly because of our fixture list. Without overlooking opponents and looking too far ahead, we have an excellent run of fixtures where we SHOULD grab three points against Reading, WBA, Norwich and Fulham. I’m expecting draws from Swansea and Everton, but hoping for wins :). The Manure fixture in GW 35 could really swing our season yet again, because if we draw with them, I fully expect us to gain much needed momentum and easily beat QPR and Wigan after that and hopefully end the season with another hard fought win against Le Toon.

    Based on the game difficulty checker, we have one of the easiest fixture lists for the rest of the season, while Spuds have to face City, Chavs, Liverpool and Everton and Chavs have to face Spuds, Manure, Liverpool and Everton.

  13. oz gunner says:

    @ HH

    I would hate to see the reaction and fallout if the game fizzles out and we lose 2-0. It would leave even more supporters wanting blood! A bit of chest pumping and spirit wouldn’t go astray either (just like the mini-argument during the tottenham game when ade was down. Also on that note, what sort of player goes down like that, asks for the stretcher, and then is right to play during the week? God that infuriates me! What annoys me even more is supporters saying ‘oh we’re so glad he is ok etc etc’. If you call for a stretcher for a hang nail you might as well hand over your testicles (not saying women are weak…they are just not as tough as men 🙂 ). Yet when players get in a push and shove on the field the commentators call it ‘handbags’. No, handbags is players rolling around on the ground feigning injuries! okay i’ll stop whinging).
    If we do lose hopefully Arsene does not say something along the lines of ‘we didn’t take it seriously because our full attention is on finishing top 4’

    ‘Le Toon’ – I like it! 🙂

    Those fixtures are very comforting. But you are right, with us you do not know what team is going to rock up. We really can’t afford to turn up and go through the motions in games, we aren’t the invincibles and don’t hold that psychological advantage over our opponents.

  14. Gerry says:

    It is almost like an interlull with all this reflective stuff?

    Totes, I agree with your assessment. While the door for future improvements is open, due to the better financial conditions now, then I think we owe it to Arsene to show what he has done in the past is not beyond him now?

    If he blows that chance then no doubt he will step down. I have every confidence in him. I think he knows where the team are falling short. He has not been afraid to show the door to players either. I would imagine over the remaining games that a good many will be left in no doubt that their future with Arsenal is on the line too?

    How many players do we need? Well we have had that discussion here. My guess is that AW will be looking to bring in strong characters in all areas, and despite our history, I think most will be known and awaiting signatures as early as June, before the TW opens. He will not want players who ‘want to study their options’, rather players that want to come to Arsenal.

    So, the future is bright, but let’s not lose sight of the need to brighten the present, eh?

  15. Gerry says:

    TA – Have a word with Milo. He was too good to have around to be allowed to drift away.

    Milo – If you are still reading, but not writing. Stick with it, you know it makes sense? Big negativity after a rare Spurs win always hangs around like a bad smell. But if you are not here you will not be he to smell the fresh coffee after a decent Bayern result?

    If it is any consolation to you HH once told me I wrote a whole lot of sh*t … but I am still here!
    (and probably still writing the same stuff?)

    This site is for intelligent people who have strong passions and strong views. Be a part of it?

  16. Red Arse says:

    Morning Guys, 🙂

    As usual it is a treat to read a TA Post and then the follow up comments.

    Good stuff from the regulars as you would expect, but special mention to OMGArsenal with his clear headed clarification of AW’s salary. (Actually, Arsene could have doubled any salary he earns at Arsenal by accepting offers from Barca, Real or Bayern).

    I contrast these reasonable comments with that from Danish Gooner who I have seen trawling around various blogs for 2 to 3 years with the same boring, disrespectful bollocks.
    He is incapable of ever saying anything positive about our manager or the club.
    Why does he bother?

    I will not let that spoil my enjoyment of the contributions from you guys — so thanks fellas!! 😀

  17. Red Arse says:

    I agree with Gerry, and his call to you Milo.

    Your intelligent knowledgeable comments, as I have said before, is excellent, and I would like to read more!!

    Come back sir!! 😀

  18. oz gunner says:

    A bit of Milo is good for everyone!

  19. VCC says:

    Morning GLiC…..I really enjoyed my Zimmer frame classes last night.

  20. Red Arse says:

    Oz is back with his Vids and now that show off VCC is joining in!! 🙂

    Nice ones guys!!

  21. TotalArsenal says:

    Morning guys and girls 🙂

    Apologies for late arrival; been busy this morning.

  22. TotalArsenal says:

    AFC, I also enjoyed the Mancs limp departure from the CL tremendously. 🙂

    To be fair, they played well in the first half and the sending off was farcical. Not a single referee in the PL would have sent Nani off for that, never, and you have got to feel for the Mancs a bit. However, it was still 1-0 to RedNose’ reindeer and with a disciplined approach and a tactical adjustment, you would have expected the Mancs to at least get extra-time. They didn’t and after the second Madrid goal they never really seemed to believe they could do it, despite some good chances to at least get the equaliser.

    There are so many fellow Gooners out there who (secretly) admire everything the Mancs do, and especially RedNose, at the moment. They apparently fight till the end and RedNose is a tactical master. But when Maureen took off a defensively minded player for an attack minded one – which he could afford given it was 11 against 10 now – the Mancs simply had no answer. Great goal by Modric, and then carved apart by another fine cross across goal by Higuan, with a relatively ease tap-in by the one they let go for money.

    The game also served as more proof that van Judas is a very good striker but not world class. The difference with Ronaldo was very obvious over both legs.

    When it really matters, in the top top games, he almost always does not deliver. In the two games between Arsenal and Milan, and now Madrid and MU, he has managed to score no goals from open play, missing numerous half decent to excellent opportunities. He converted a penalty, that is all. Same goes for his time in the Dutch national side. If I were paying a player a £1m a month, I would want him to score in these sort of games…

    The Mancs apparently want to off-load their other £12m a year striker, Rooney, now, but I don’t think it will be easy to get rid of him; even though PSG have shown an interest.

    All good fun. 🙂

  23. TotalArsenal says:

    HH at 1.16 fine comment and your last paragraph nutshells it beautifully:

    “Perhaps AW has taken us as far as he can, but that does not diminish the fact that he ushered in a new era for us where we fielded imo the best team ever, stood by us in difficult times and did not abandon us for greener pastures when he had to work with considerably less.”

    Lovely stuff HH 🙂

  24. TotalArsenal says:

    Hi OMGArsenal,

    Thanks for your comment and agreed with the content. Please leave the name-calling out though. 🙂

  25. TotalArsenal says:

    Hi Alan,

    I don’t totally agree with your statement, but it is hard to argue against you at the moment. I agree with your statement: “We have no world class keeper, no leader in central defence, no serious holding midfielder and lack a serious central striker.”

    The question is whether these ‘vacancies’ can still be filled by Arsene over the summer through developing players and buying a few quality new ones. We will have to see what he does and whether he is still able to transform the team. At the moment, I am a lot less sure than I was seven months ago, but I am not giving up on him just yet.

  26. TotalArsenal says:

    HH/Oz that is a nice topic for a post: ‘Why Arsenal will/will not finish in top-four this season’. I’d say start writing guys! 😛

  27. TotalArsenal says:

    Lovely comment, Gerry, and good to see that you at least still fully believe in Arsene. I hope you are right re early signings, which would give us stability and a summer to work hard and get the team ready to rock come August. But it could easily be another summer of speculation and false hope too. I prefer your positive variant, though! 🙂

  28. TotalArsenal says:

    Hi Milo 🙂

    If you are still reading get your Canadian arse right back here. Just try not to read too much into comments and start with the principle of ‘I am OK, You are OK’ when blogging. We all have different styles and viewpoints, and you need a bit of a thick skin to enjoy the blogging. I like your direct, often quite opinionated style, but please bare in mind, it sometimes will get fellow bloggers to respond in equal levels of directness and outspoken opinions. But in the end, we all are Gooners and want the best for the club.

    So get back here, compadre, and share your views with us again! 🙂

  29. TotalArsenal says:

    Hi Redders 🙂

    I guess your comment re DG was a reflection of all his contributions you read by him over the years. I did not think his comment last night was that bad and he stayed polite.

    I guess your patience has been tested to the limit by the likes of Crumpets and DG recently! 😦

    Don’t let them get to you Redders; that’s exactly what they enjoy!

  30. oz gunner says:

    “He has had 5 wives and 20 kids and lives in a shoe box!!”

    Brilliant RA!!!!

  31. Red Arse says:

    Hi TA,

    You are right. Danish is not given to swearing or insulting people, but he has been just so negative over the time he has blogged on sites where I too blogged, so when I saw his comment I just thought ‘oh, oh, here he goes again’.

    But fear not he will be back again. He is made of resolute stuff! 🙂

    I am perfectly happy with constructive criticism of pretty much anything, as I do not pretend to know the answer to the various problems that occur — it is just the constant negativity of a growing minority that is making me question why I bother.

    Of course, I probably should just pull out of blogging, and I am thinking about it.

  32. Red Arse says:

    Thanx, Oz, and I have even written a Manure joke over on AA. 🙂

    Have to go and lie down while I rest my brain!!

  33. Gerry says:

    TA – I think we can afford tp be a little more optimistic in the TW this time.

    Look at the state of play going into it. We only have one signature waiting on the home front, which with a few blinding performances between now the end of season, that should be sorted.

    We are not having to haggle down to the last euro, although some bargaining will be done, we have cash – None of that half now and the rest tied up with performance issues.

    We will ave a good idea who is on our shortlist, and is likely to be available.

    I think IG is up to speed on how these things work now? Just look at how quick the Monreal deal took to complete once Gibbs is injury scan showed the extended time he would be missing for. So they can do it.

    I am also guessing that a lot of work is already be done behind the scenes to know just who is prepared to sell and what price they are looking for. However, I don’t think it will bear much resemblance to the players we ‘missed out on’ in January?

    That will be the first challenge that AW will face if he does not bring in the ‘big name’ players?

    I also can see some of our existing first eleven, and fringers, going in the face of strong competition coming in? I would not like to name names – nor do I suggest you make that a topic for your next blog! – because it is a little unfair on players who could yet produce some outstanding form before season’s close?

    One thing for a blog a bit nearer the time is a potential line up for they Bayern game that came to me earlier this morning:

    Formation wise it is a variant on 4-4-2. The front pair of Gnabry and Podolski line more in a 1-1, with Poldi playing off Serge’s shoulder. Then you have Santi and Rosicky out wider,but licence to roam. Behind them you have Jack bring the ball from defence to attack quickly with pass and move stuff to get space to run at them. Behind him is Arteta doing the DM thing, but expecting everybody bar Gnabry to get back into defensive mode quickly. Then you have the back 4, hopefully with Sagna, either as centre back or RB. No Gibbs unfortunately, he is going to need at least a couple more weeks – Easter if we are lucky? – so unless one of the youngsters come in, I guess that will mean TV5 out at LB?

    No room for Walcott or the OX in the starting line up, but, along with Giroud, great to have on the bench?

    I think we have to give it a go in the first half, and may be they know we are a bit predictable with the Giroud/Walcott line up, so this could throw them? Enough to make them nervous if we got a couple of early goals. It might point the way to how we get results in the league too?

  34. Gerry says:

    Redders, Would you like me to come on AA and give you a positive outlook?

    Thanks for the support in ‘We Want Our Milo Back’ campaign. Although when I read on i thought you were still talking about me,ha ha!

    It must be nearly dawn over there by now – Wakey, Wakey, Milo!


    Very nice TA

    If one man deserves respect at Arsenal its Arsene Wenger.

    People can question his managerial ability and wether he is the right man to take us forward etc, and thats all fine and indeed healthy. But to call him names or say that he has his own selfish agenda is not right in my book.

    I personaly still think he is the right man for the job. I think he will go out on a high, either winning the Premeirship or Champions League, and i look forward to that day.

  36. TotalArsenal says:

    No Redders, never pull out of blogging compadre: that would be a massive, massive disaster! 😦

    We should just remember that some people are only happy when it rains; when their negative view of Arsenal – and possibly life in general – is once again confirmed by events.

    Stick around buddy, we need you! 🙂

  37. TotalArsenal says:

    Hi Gerry, all sounds reasonable to me. The future might well be bright again and there are plenty of reasons to remain positive. I just have to still get over our recent performances, and hopefully we will start to play better again.

    Re the Bayern game: yes, nearer the time we will do a post along the lines of ‘how to achieve the impossible’. 🙂

  38. TotalArsenal says:

    Don’t we all look fwd to that day, Merry Terry! 🙂

  39. Red Arse says:

    Thanx, TA, 🙂

    It is a balancing act at the moment between the many BK guys who I love to see commenting on BK, and to participate in the debates with them, versus the tiresome people who I think are negative just for the sake of it.

    Can I make a personal comment here?

    I know that Herb sometimes comes across in a certain light, and it can make other bloggers a bit cross, but you and I know him well, and the comments he makes are borne out of a deep love of Arsenal, and his fears for the future of the club

    I have asked Herb, in the past, to occasionally point out an attribute about the club or the manager that we could all agree with! 🙂
    You know — we are a classy club (and I think you have said that Herb), or that we have a wonderful stadium which is worth every penny (not sure you have said that) 🙂 or that this summer we will buy 2 or 3 top, top quality players to make us real contenders next season????? 🙂

    Herb does care.

  40. TotalArsenal says:

    Fully agreed on your ‘descrtption’ of the Herbster, Redders” 🙂


    Redders, i can not allow this to happen. i know Hertfordshire well and using my various contacts woild have no problem tracking you down. So unless you want an irate Terry parked outside your house demanding his Redders Fix i suggest keep posting. hahaha

    I also agree about Herb.Hes a true Gooner with a historical perspective and i love him for it.

    But hes also negative as F*ck and drives me crazy. hahaha

  42. Herb'sArmy says:

    Hi everyone, thanks for yet another cracker, Total.
    Thanks for taking the time to explain a few things, yesterday Redders.
    Gerry, I read as many Arsenal Blogs as are out there, some are uber positive, and some are downright negative. Some are playing the long game, some are concerned we won’t make it in the long game. Arsenal are divided right now, and it is a very unhealthy divide, each trying to claim the moral high-ground whilst ridiculing their ‘opponents’ points.
    To assume a role in life where you’re forever in the public spotlight, and you’re responsible for millions of different individuals moods who disect every aspect of your work, takes courage.
    Football has become politicised, and it has become spoiled by vulgar amounts of money to the point where only a few elite clubs can really compete, which is why football supporters of many other clubs are rapidly losing interest. The days of Derby winning a title or Ipswich triumphing in Europe are distant blurs of what used to be pure sport, played largely on a level-playing field. Fortunately, Arsenal have always been among the elite, from the days of Henry Norris, and being located in the capital city has certainly played its part, so in that sense, Arsenal should always compete.
    To truly determine the man’s worth, you have to decide if what he has done for Arsenal is greater than what he hasn’t done. Effectively, 1996-2005 v 2006-2013. The Invincibles and the stadium move v not winning the European Cup/CL, or balancing the justification of top four v winning domestic cups (FA, Lge Cup). There-in lies the crux of the debate. You could ask 100 different people and you’d probably get a hundred different explanations.

  43. Red Arse says:

    Fair point, Herb.

    But it should not be forgotten that being a supporter is not just about money, or the lack of it, neither is it all about positives and negatives (how I dislike those terms — makes us sound like a car battery) 🙂

    The fact is (to use the vernacular) we are where we are, whatever the reasons for that.

    A supporter — supports, regardless of all else. We hope for the best, we discuss the pros and cons, and we settle, at the end of the day, for what is, because if we do not do that there is no hope for the future — and there is no club.

    Just a thought.

  44. Herb'sArmy says:

    Hi Redders,
    I appreciate I can sound tiresome and really down on Arsenal at times, but I will never insult the manager with poisoned hatred, nor will I personally insult another blogger who has a positive outlook. As I’ve said previously, I think one’s background and personal circumstances can cloud their overall view of the club. When life is good, you can rationalise your team’s defeat by looking at all the positives, and though it hurts, you convince yourself that a positive result is just around the corner. For those whose life isn’t so good, every defeat compounds and reinforces their negative view of their world, and it is a difficult mind-set to escape from.

  45. VCC says:

    VCC ..UMF 1 entry.. =

    Man City v Barnsley……..Home
    Everton v Wigan………….Home
    Newcastle v Stoke……….Draw
    WBA v Swans……………..Draw
    Millwall v Blackburn………Draw

  46. Gerry says:

    Herb – I realised very early on that you were not only a veteran of this site, but also a veteran Arsenal supporter, from the warm greetings you got from your friends on here.

    This is why I did not get involved when you aired you views with HH. I think HH said you were stuck in the past, as you do make frequent references to a bygone era. But from your comment @14.45 you are clearly aware of the changes in the world today. It is this that I found most puzzling in many of your postings, as you seem to think that AW could still act in the same way as in the past, without any of these factors affecting him? That may not be you actual view, but it is what is conveyed by some posting.

    If your friends are saying you should ‘lighten up’ a bit, I don’t think I was too far wrong when I said I had not read a single positive comment since your return?

    I fully understand that if personal circumstances are tough, and when in the days gone by you could rely on Arsenal to give you an escape route of joy, if only for a short while? I don’t say that lightly, because as many are aware my own circumstances are not tickety boo right now, either. I am not making comparisons here, for I have no knowledge of your problems, and we all have different outlook on life in general. I have described myself as a Mr McCawber type. One who believes something will turn up for the better, no matter how bleak it looks at the time. I used to tell the kids on the school bus run I did, that when driving, ‘I would rather be lucky than good’, and I was, as they would be only too quick to tell you!

    Seriously, I have no wish to make you feel more negative. Ironically, I mentioned your name in response, not to something you had said on the subject, but rather, it seemed to me, that your comments were making others feel more negative, and were responding in kind.

    You know what they say Herb, ‘A trouble shared means more people know your damn business!’

    So can I end any ill feeling you may have towards me for pointing out that you can sound ‘really tiresome’, to use your own words, and try to see a brighter future ahead, without any comparison to the past. If Double H can still remain positive after a Spud’s loss – and I know his faith must have been sorely tested?? – then you might help yourself by a little wishful thinking over the coming weeks?

    p.s. The use of the term ‘veteran’ was meant not in reference to age but to equal ‘long term’. We may also be of a similar vintage anyway?

  47. Red Arse says:

    Sorry, Herb,

    I feel that in trying to be supportive I may have made you uncomfortable, which is the opposite of what I intended.

    (I think Gerry is also being supportive — it’s the way he tells them!!) 😀

  48. Red Arse says:


    I have not forgotten your question about Arsenal transfer purchases, but I have been a bit tied up this afternoon [let me go Terry – what will Glic say?] 🙂 but I will try and get back to you on that tomorrow!

  49. Gerry says:

    Redders – I have to thank you wasting some more of my valuable time today … I went to the AA site, I even observed comment that were glic’s by another name. I also spotted the Next Gen link – So I indulged myself watching us play Inter Milan.

    The weather was bad. The pitch terrible. If you think of a Park’s pitch with poor drainage on wet November, then you have a fair idea of what they had to put up with? Standing water everywhere. Both sides tried to keep the ball off the ground, as anything on the deck would, as likely as not, come to a sudden halt about 10 yards before its intended target.

    The good news is, the Kids are in the Next Gen semi-final!

    A pick up and run, followed by a screamer of a shot from the very busy boy, Nico Yennaris. He was involved a lot in midfield, and my MOTM. It was difficult to get any sort of service to the front two guys, Akpom and Gnabry because of the surface. I had to laugh when Akpon back into their GK, he looked more like a GK than the real thing. He will be a very big lad when he stops growing!
    Iliev was very good in our goal too. The sides of the pitch were so waterlogged that the likes of Bellerin and Angha struggled down the flanks. Late on, after we scored, they really pressed us, but thankfully they hung on.

    So thank you for that Redders. I shall now have to catch up tonight!

  50. Highbury Harmony says:


    I don’t like this persona you seem to have developed in your head of me hahaha (I’m kidding 😉 ). To set the record straight, I am quite positive about Arsenal and will defend them and its players/manager/coaches if I feel they are being unfairly represented in comments. I always see hope in this club because without it, supporting this club is almost meaningless!

    However, I will NOT reserve my criticism for certain players and overall team performances if I know that they can perform to a higher standard. In addition, I will be direct and respond/question commenters who see no fault with the club and believe that the manager/BoD/owner/players (etc.) can do no wrong.

  51. Red Arse says:


    Quite right. As committed fans we all have the right to discuss the whys and wherefores of players and even the manager, and if we are not happy it is perfectly correct to highlight that opinion. Nothing wrong with that.

    What would be wrong is where opinions are stated as ‘facts’ or the manager is vilified based on someone quoting as factual, comments or feelings he is supposed to have which are purely conjecture and speculation.

    But then I have not seen that done on here by anyone!

    [Of course, if the fans of another club say such things I would tell them to f**k off!] 😀

  52. Red Arse says:


    You are very welcome!! 😀

  53. The Gooner says:


    100% agreed.

    I had a field day having to respond to those exact types of comments regarding our club and manager in the “say no to boycotting” article I wrote a while back! All speculation and media spewed crap, scary to see first hand how influential the media is in our lives…

  54. Milo says:

    Hey, I guess I threw a bit of a tantrum when HH didn’t agree with me about the Nani sending off!!! 😦 I mean, I don’t really get along much with anyone in real life. So I thought that going on here was just another reminder of that. I’m sure he was puzzled though that I would say I’m not coming on here again over that!!! That was stupid of me.

    Our under 21’s beat Inter Milan on a rain soaked pitch tonight!!!:D See??? We DO have some players who can compete when things are tough and going against them!!! 😀 1-0 was the scoreline!!! 😀 I have seen some of Nico Yennaris over the past couple of seasons, and Isaac Hayden, a centre back who played in midfield today, are two players who COULD make it here. We haven’t seen much of Coquelin, and I wonder if Wenger is slowly going to bring Yennaris along. He can play right back as well as defensive midfield. Just like Coquelin. I don’t know anything for sure obviously, but it’s a theory. Yennaris is a true Gooner, like Jenkinson, except even more so, because he was a mascot at Highbury when he was a wee one 😀 I wouldn’t mind Wenger giving him an honest look next season, or even at the end of this one, if we are out of it??? 😦 Hopefully we aren’t!!! 😀

  55. Milo says:

    Oops!!! Gerry already posted about the Next-Gen series match against Inter!!! 😀 hahahahaha, sorry Gerry!!! 😀

  56. TotalArsenal says:

    Hi Milo 🙂

    Really good to see you back and it takes a man to post a comment like you just did. 🙂

    Fully agreed on Yennaris. I watched him here in Norwich against the Canaries Reserves about a year ago, and he was fantastic.

  57. TotalArsenal says:

    New Post 🙂

    I am off to bed now (early morning beckons), but will get back to you during the day.

  58. nutcase says:

    I’ve not read all the comments, but the article and some of the comments does show how much respect there is for this man. May be this year, Mr Wenger has underperformed (like the squad), MAY BE. That doesnt mean he has lost it as some suggest.

    Mr Wenger deserves an extension in contract. This man stood by us during our financial difficulties. Guided us through the choppy waters, chocked (might have) some of his strategies and ideas to keep Arsenal up and running. It would be inhumane to look at someone else to guide us forward when we are healthier (financially), without giving him a deserved chance.

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