What’s up with Jack? And why did Rosicky not play yesterday?


Last night, Jack had plenty of fire in his belly but his legs and mind seem out of sync.

It is so good to see Super Jackie Wilshere back on the pitch again. With his injury record, it is always a worry when he is out of contention for a long while, so to see him in our shirt again is simply great.

But the Jack who returned against Norwich, and had another game against Everton three days later, hardly looks like the giant killer we have become accustomed to, and have been so enthusiastic about, this season.

His motivation is never in doubt and the passion and healthy aggression he adds to the team is of great importance, but something is missing at the moment.

His first touch and passing accuracy have not been great to say the least, and I also did not see much of that characteristic burst forward of Jack, or many of his quality through-balls. He looks like a player who does not believe he is ready for the big battles again, despite trying very hard.

Now it is fair to say that he was targeted by Everton in such a way that he hardly could conduct our game last night: it was a very obvious and just about legitimate tactic by the Toffees; and with little protection from the referee things were not made easier for him either. But still, the Jack we all know, is normally able to deal with this.

Actually, it was a total surprise to see Wilshere included in the line-up last night. Wenger had come out prior to the game and admitted he might have rushed him back too quickly; only to confuse us all by playing him again three days later….. 😕

I am a big fan of Jack and love to see him play, but it does not seem right that he is preferred to the apparently fully fit again Rosicky. Our little Mozart has had a few fine games for us recently and really helped to give us drive, shape and purpose to our football again.

Perhaps, Arsene is keen to build the team around Wilshere once again, with him positioned in the most advanced midfield position; and I for one, am totally in favour of this. But this is not a time to take risks by reintroducing a rusty and seemingly lacking in confidence Wilshere to such a pivotal position and with such little room for error. 

We were doing well with Rosicky’s organisational skills and thrust in the centre of midfield, and with his experience he seems our safest bet to help us finish in the top-four again by the end of the season.

How ever much I love Wilshere, I am really hoping Wenger will opt for Rosicky in the hole against Fulham, so we can get our shape, focus and thrust back again. Jack’s time will come again, but now it’s time for Arsene to allow Rosicky to get us back to winning ways.

Written by: TotalArsenal.

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180 Responses to What’s up with Jack? And why did Rosicky not play yesterday?

  1. Bond James says:

    Jack is still not match fit.

    Rosicky didn’t play because wenger obviously feels he’s better suited at keeping the bench warm since we lost the likes of chamakh and arshavin .

    on a more serious note, jack is better suited marshaling the midfield with arteta in the hole and then making those runs, better to play santi ahead of him and start ox/poldi on the left , that best enables him to play to his best.

  2. jack says:

    jack is just a overrated little english boy. rosicky with one leg is much better then jack wilsher. jack has only had 1goal and 2 goal assist all season. we need world class players not overrated lillte boys.

  3. allezkev says:

    Good post Total…
    Yes, I was also surprised to see Jack start again.
    Not sure about the fitness of Rosicky?
    That does seem a strange one?!
    If Rosicky had played against Everton, and bearing in mind the challenges that that muppet referee allowed, we’d probably be seeing Tomas out for the rest of the season!
    I do hope he starts at Craven Cottage this weekend.

  4. AFC says:

    TA, fine post. 🙂

    With Arteta and Ramsey holding and Rosicky/Cazorla playing in the whole the midfield was playing really well and looked quite balanced. Jack coming back in has uinsettled the midfield. I like Jack but I feel Wenger should avoid starting him for the rest of the season until he can get back to his best. He needs to play himself back into form and needs to play matches to do so. The problem is these are now the most important matches of the season so for me we cannot afford to let Jack play his way back into form.

  5. rufus says:

    What’s wrong with using him as a sub.

  6. AFC says:

    Jack, I would like you to expand. I see your point in jack being fractionly overrated by the English media and pundits but you will have to tell me the degree to which you think Jack is overrated.

  7. AFC says:

    BJ, for me he is playing in a too attacking role. Jack for me plays better as a DM where he can drive forward. For Jack, the deeper the better for me.

  8. Bond James says:


    overrated little english boy ? no wonder Roy h wants him back in the england team when he is half fit or top players from germany sing wilshere’s praises ah, i forgot spanish players as well.

    the little boy has a heart of a lion, represents what we stand for and actually unlike many, is always up for a fight –

    the amount of stick and criticism he gets for always trying his heart out is beyond comprehension, ok, so he only scored 2 goals ? (might i remind everyone, those 2 goals were very important at the time, 1 against mont in champions league to get us off the mark when everyone was nervous in the emirates and the 2nd one a sweet hit from his left , when we really needed a goal)…ok, fair enough the assists aren’t as high as well as the goals but the movement, impetus, gile, penetration he gives this Arsenal team is indispensable .

    it’s harsh on Rosicky to be on the bench but maybe Wenger knew something that we didn’t (Rosicky still not fit ?

  9. TotalArsenal says:

    Thanks for comments guys. Will get back to you in the morning 🙂

  10. AFC says:

    Jack, another thing. All English players are overrated little boys. Bit what you have to see is that Jack is probably the furthest away from a overrated little boy out of the England players. Cleverly, Jones etc. Are the kings of overrated little boys.

  11. AFC says:

    * but

  12. Bond James says:


    agreed, hence i said in my OP along side Arteta, it allows him to make his runs and control the midfield a tad more , also brings him in a CAM role in the 2nd half…..

    for me he needs to be playing in the Ramsey role, it’s tough on Ramsey but let’s face it, when you have Ramsey as your best player or MOTM then that means Arsenal’s not going to be winning many games or none at all (yep, rest of the players went missing)

  13. allezkev says:

    Jack, where do you come from?

  14. rufus says:

    You don’t put unfit players on the bench. The guy makes a good point Wilshere stats are pretty meagre. Now Santi Cazorla is the man, he’s different gravy, he carries that Team

  15. Howi says:

    The sad truth is that whenever jack plays, we seem to struggle…,it hurts me to say this and am starting to think that jack is not as good as we all want to believe. I don’t think he is suited to the ‘number ten’ role. I believe rosicky and carzola do a much better job there. The team lacks sharpness whenever he plays and we tend to pass the ball around without initiating any attacks. Arsene should avoid starting jack for the rest of the season as we need those points at the moment.

  16. AFC says:

    Guys, have you thought of Wenger playing a narrow formation. I feel this could be the way forward. Our only decent wide play somes from our fullbacks and our winger are not really wingers. The Ox, Cazorla and Rosicky are AMs. Walcott and Gervinho are poachers and Podolski is a false 9. So it would be better suited to most of our players to play in a narrow fornation.

    What do you guys think?

  17. AFC says:

    Howi, Wilshere is far from a no.10 for me. If anything he is a DM or a box to box midfielder. His final ball iis not yet good enough an shooting is not his strong point so this makes Wilshere less effective when playing as a no. 10.

  18. Bond James says:

    for whatever it’s worth then we should use theo, giroud more off the bench, they can have a far greater impact off the bench instead of starting.

    give starts to the likes of OX, Podolski and Gervinho (yep, there i have said it).

  19. jack says:

    arsenal have bein on the best run off the season without jack wilshere we won against Bayern in germany without jack wilshere and lost at home when he played. soon as he went off against norwich we won the game. even ramsay looks like a better player then jack wilshere now. hes not the no10 shit player with 2goals and 1assist. england need wilshere alot more then arsenal do. fact is hes a english media made player more talking then playing.

  20. davi says:

    We haven’t played well with Wilshere all season, so it was an unnecessary risk to bring him back now. IMO if we want to play Jack in this side we need a serious rethink on how best to do it, and, particularly given his recent injury problems, now isn’t the time for that. Ramsey is looking our best player at the moment, and he and Arteta are holding the midfield as well as could be expected, so it’s just a question of who plays alongside them. I expect Rosicky was left out against Everton because he was also injured recently and probably hadn’t fully recovered to the same extent that we felt Jack had – beyond those 2, I don’t see too many other options to be honest. I’m not sure Cazorla is really the answer as I think we need a midfielder with a stronger defensive game and Caz is better higher up the pitch, as is Oxlade, generally speaking. Perhaps the forgotten man Coquelin would be a better bet (assuming Rosicky is not fully fit)? He would certainly give us more of a bite in midfield and it’s not like we’re really getting much creativity from that area anyway. Ramsey has been our most dangerous outlet from the CM positions recently with some late runs from deep, and that’s something that Coquelin is adept at doing as well (as is Yenaris btw). It’s probably not the best time for experimentation but I’d rather we gave Coq a proper go rather than risk a half fit Jack Wilshere or a half fit Rosicky.

  21. AFC says:

    Jack, Wilshere still has a long way to go and it would be better to judge him later on in his career.

  22. Howi says:

    @ AFC totally agree with u buh lookin at how ramsey’s playin, wilshere will have to work hard to displace him

  23. AFC says:

    Davi, do you want Coquelin to play in the hole?

  24. Howi says:

    @ jack, wilshere might be the next michael owen…the media’z makin him look so good and he aint

  25. jack says:

    the team was on a loseing run befor jack got injured and in fact they have not lost a game since hes bein out. even at start off the season we never lost a game tel jack got back.belive it or not real arsenal fans jack wilshere is the weak link off this team. we have won alot more games when hes not playing.

  26. Howi says:

    Davi, coquelin in the hole?,.,.,criusly?

  27. davi says:

    AFC – I don’t know what has happened to him to be honest. I think Wilshere is a much more naturally gifted attacker than he’s shown since breaking into the first team – partly because he’s mostly been played in the centre of midfield, often in those deep-lying roles. No one really considered Ramsey a defensive midfielder, but he’s performed much better recently since switching to that role. Basically I think he was a bit low on confidence and playing deeper allowed him to play a simple game and really get used to the pace of things, and then when Arteta came back he was able to make more and more runs forward and now we’re seeing a very good box-to-box midfielder who could become anything he wants to imo. So far Wilshere has seemingly just done whichever job has been going. We needed him to hold the midfield next to Song in his first season, and he did it admirably, but this year we’ve asked him to come in, after a long injury break, and attempt to recreated what Fabregas did a few years ago – it’s too much. In his case, maybe some time on the wing would be more beneficial. I’ve always been most impressed with him in the few games he played in the 4-4-2 system as a right midfielder. His natural tenacity is always important, and in that case useful for protecting the fullback, but he used to have a very decent shot on his left foot. He would also use that burst of pace to cut in past the opposition fullback and have a shot or play a pass. Now he’s trying to use that burst to beat 6 players in central areas and just losing the ball. I don’t believe Jack Wilshere is a very complicated player, he does simple things well but has that burst of pace to take him into space. Putting him on the wing would also remove a bit of the pressure as he wouldn’t automatically stand out as the go-to player.

  28. davi says:

    I didn’t say play Coquelin in the hole I said as another midfielder. Arteta-Ramsey-Coquelin (whatever order) gives you a strong base and Ramsey and Coq are very fit and good at making forward runs. Just saying it makes more sense than playing unfit midfielders

  29. AFC says:

    Davi, playing Jack in a free role on the RW could be the way forward.

  30. davi says:

    We don’t have to line up with one holding midfielder, one box-to-box midfielder and one just behind the striker. I’m simply suggesting a system which relies more on runners from midfield than your more creative AMs like Rosicky or Cazorla. It’s a question of what is available.

  31. AFC says:

    Davi, understand you now.

    Another thing we could do is play a tight 4-2-3-1. Have Arteta and Ramsey holding with 4 attacking players in front having the freedom to interchange positions. If you really wanted you could play Podolski, Walcott, Giroud and the Ox in the front four.

  32. AFC says:

    @ 23:48. *hole
    * unsettled

  33. Bobby Sure says:

    Why is it that your either overrated or underrated in the world of footballing opinions ? Anyway

    TA is right – rosicky must play; bearing in mind how long it took jack to regain form from his last injury break. However moving forward he absolutely is our number 10 in waiting. He’s the philosophical embodiment of wenger and arsenals style in that position. Quick, aggressive,technical,incisive. Thats far too many weapons to be wasted playing deep. The reason why he looks more comfortable as a DM is because that position doesn’t force him to dominate the game. Jack is better than keeping it simple. I recall many saying the same about cesc. “Oh hes not a CAM” his feet are too slow, hes not a natural goalscorer etc. etc. Now he’s playing in the best team in world football and is known as one of the best AM’s in world football.

    I’d even argue that wilshere has more tools than cesc for this position. The beauty of jack that suits us moving forward is the pace at which he can play, which is pivotal to our quick combinations. A lot of people seem to remember jack in the pivot with song, however I remember the player that was deftly backheeling passes in traffic to the likes of arshavin and chamakh. Rosicky is the temporary answer to make sure we secure our CL spot for next season. However the dynamism of wilshere as a number 10 is mouthwatering. He could well change the mould and how people view this position.

  34. Jack and Santi are the same! says:

    Quite simple really. Jack and Santi are the same players. They over-shadow each other. They both might work but they need alot of understanding, intelligence and technique especially if they want to emulate Iniesta, Xavi, Messi, Villa. It also helps if you have a great striker up front. Because you know that all the good work you put into midfield will never be realised up front. Giroud is a Championship player at best. How many times have Arsenal scored from a cross from Clichy, Sagna, Gibbs, Jenkinson? Never! Why? Because AW wants 10 midfielders in his squad. Take Giroud off at half time. Move Theo to the striking position and bring on AOC. That match was there to be won. So as I coach you need to move players around. Yes I agree that AW has a system and a system prevails over tactics. But this only works when you have the players to play that system. Half of the team are incapable of playing the system so you need tactical changes. This is where AW is wrong and this is why this team fails.

  35. rufus says:

    If Jack played in the Bergkamp era, he would learn and develop his game much easier because of the quality of players in the side, much like Ray Parlour did.

  36. Milo says:

    I HATE panic…especially when it comes to players and their form. I was always behind Ramsey, when he was out of form, and I am behind Wilshere now. This kind of article just invites people to bash Wilshere, or label him as “overrated” etc, etc. I know you worked hard on this TA, but I wouldn’t have written it, because people like “Mike” and others will come on and say that Wilshere has always been overrated, and will never be good enough. I thought the player ratings from last match were enough for people to draw their own conclusions, and comment on how poorly he played.

    There is a lot of expectation placed on Wilshere, and when he is given a full run in the side, and is completely healthy, he more than justifies that expectation. Conversely, when he cannot play to his full capabilities, he is then labelled as overrated or not good enough. I wouldn’t feed that fire any more than is necessary. He will be a great player, whether some people like it or not.

    I do not stand by Wenger playing him at this point in time, unless he shows that he is back to his best in training. I cannot believe that he has done so in the past couple of weeks. There is plenty of time for Wilshere to recuperate, and prepare for next season, and be prepared to fill in, when needed from the bench, in this current season.

  37. foreverheady says:

    The worrying thing for me is the effect that Jack seems to have on Santi, who seems largely anonymous when Jack is playing. It is almost as if both players feel the need to be the most influential and the most loved by the crowd. The problem is made worse by the fact that they look to play in very different ways, and so have a huge influence when they impose their footballing philosophy on the team.

    The biggest challenge for AW is to get them both playing in total harmony as they are both wonderful players: at the moment the sum of their individual contributions is greater than their collective whole and Arsenal won’t flourish until they mesh together properly.

  38. jgc says:

    Hi All,

    Couple of thoughts/responses:

    a. Consider Wenger’s position before Everton. We have 6 games left and he needs either Rosicky or Wilshere. I think we agree that without both we’d be hurting.. So, perhaps he plays Wilshere to get some game legs under him and figuring he will hopefully be better than his first trip back vs Norwich, which he was, just not stellar.

    Equally, that thought might have been easier for him to make if Rosicky, with a history of fragility, is not quite 100%. Rest him just a touch and go for it with Wilshere that evening.

    Raises interesting question of who we will see vs Fulham! I hope for Rosicky to start and Wilshere to sub if needed or if we are ahead at say 60-70 mins to keep getting football time into his legs

    b. Bobby, it’s simple. All football players are over/under rated because they are either on form or not. I.e. none are perfect. You rarely see anyone under rating Messi and, frankly, it’s hard tho not impossible, to over rate him! After that tho… 🙂

    cheers — jgc

  39. TotalArsenal says:

    Morning fine fellow Gooners 🙂

    Some very good comments last night, cheers.

    Milo, Jack’s rustiness and not playing Rosicky is a hot topic at the moment, and I have no regrets in writing this post. I am huge fan of Wilshere and fully agree with Bobby S’ assessment, but let’s take some Jack criticism on the chin and judge it on its merits. That is what blogging is all about. 🙂

    Back later.

  40. macko says:

    bonjour, le problème de jack viens de son placement il ne doit pas jouer en numéro 10 en numéro 8 au coté d’Arteta comme avec Song !!!!!
    Ensuite nous avons perdus le match suite a un manque de précision dans nos passe et surtout nos finitions une fois ce problème réglé nous serons dans les très très fort 😉

  41. Red Arse says:

    Morning People, 🙂

    Jack @23;28, “jack is just a overrated little english boy”. Were you referring to yourself?

  42. Red Arse says:

    Bonjour macko, 🙂

    Je suis d’accord avec votre commentaire.

  43. jgc says:


    An interesting thought to put Jack back and more defensively. Personally, for all his strength and creativity he has the toughness also to be a short DM beast.

    IMO, that toughness and spirit might suit him there and playing “behind the play” to organise might suit his skills well and provide a platform for his forays forward.

    cheers — jgc

  44. jack says:

    jack wilshere is the weak link off this team we have lost more games when he plays.and if he reali was so called world class he wont be playin for arsenal

  45. TotalArsenal says:

    jack are you the little boy inside Robin van Judas?


    Jack, do you like anagrams Weak Link = Like Wank

  47. TotalArsenal says:

    Super Jackie Wilshere can play anywhere in midfield and make a huge success of it, as long as he is fit and can play a few games in succession again. The best talent England have had for a long time, and if you cannot see that, then that is fine with me.

    Only when Jack returned to the team this season did we start to see some shape, hunger and purpose to our football, something that Rosicky also offers, but not so much by Cazorla.

    We have played better recently, as in getting some well needed wins, by leaving Vermaelen out and asking Mertesacker to organise the back and by instructing Arteta and Ramsey to sit tighter together in front of the back-four; and leave the attacking to the ‘front four’.

    Jack is struggling right now but this is hopefully to do with rustiness and nothing more seriously.

    In the long run, Jack is, in my view, likely to end up as our most advanced midfield player. With three attackers in front of him and additional support from the midfield (box-to-boxer) and from the wings he will add both the much needed trust, quick change overs and through-balls. He would be also ideal in a 4-1-2-3, where he can play in the ‘2’ with Cazorla, Rosicky or Ox.

    However, I also agree that he could be very effective in the long run as the box to box midfielder, with a player like Jovetic in the hole and a beast of a DM next to him.

    I am sure we will have many debates about this in the next few years, and I am less sure currently what his best position will be long term.

  48. TotalArsenal says:

    Although it would be great if Jack was scoring more goals this season, let’s remember he is not a 4-4-1-1 number ’10’, with just a striker ahead of him. In our system, he has three attackers ahead of him and his main task is to set up attacking moves, creating many indirect and direct assists in the process. And he has all the qualities needed for this.


    Hi TA

    Once again, i completely agree with you.

    i had to refrain from making a comment last night because some of the posts were getting on my nerves. There was definatly a tinge of anti Englishness, from people who i believe no nothing about Arsenal or the traditions and heritage of the club.

  50. VCC says:

    Terrance……. 😉

  51. Bond James says:


    that’s right, real world class players are sold for £80 million to a team, that knocks you out of the champions league oh and the real world class player scores the killer blow 😀

    truth be told, every team in the PL would want to have Wilshere or are midfield, i don’t even see man Utd’s midfield players getting into our starting 11 – FACT.

    it’s a minor dip in form for wilshere coming back from injury, the good news is that now he has some much needed game time after 6 weeks of no playing, i expect him to deliver from saturday onwards

  52. Red Arse says:


    I posted this elsewhere, but in case anyone else has not seen it, I will re-post it here. 🙂

    The Forbes rich list of football clubs has been released.

    Real Madrid has overtaken Manchester United as the world’s most valuable football club, according to business magazine Forbes.

    It is the first time that Man Utd has lost the top spot since Forbes first started compiling its list in 2004.

    Forbes now values the Spanish giant at $3.3bn (£2.2bn), with Man Utd in second place on $3.17bn. Barcelona is third.

    Forbes said Real Madrid’s financial success came despite the continuing woes of the Spanish economy.

    “Real Madrid has been consistently delivering the highest revenues of any soccer team in the world, despite an intense economic meltdown in Spain,” said Forbes.

    “With superstars like Cristiano Ronaldo on the pitch, and coach Jose Mourinho on the bench, Real Madrid has thrived under the leadership of billionaire president Florentino Perez.”

    In coming to its figures, Forbes looks at a football club’s various revenue streams, such as television money, ticket sales, merchandise and concessions.

    After Barcelona on $2.6bn, Forbes found that — Arsenal was the fourth richest club, worth $1.33bn, — followed by Bayern Munich ($1.31bn), AC Milan ($945m), Chelsea ($901m), Juventus ($694m), Manchester City ($689m) and Liverpool ($651m).

    Source BBC.

    There are many ways of calculating these lists, but there can be no doubt that Barca and Real Madrid, apart from their huge TV deals, really cream off the commercial sponsorship deals [and sadly so do Manyoo] because on-field success in this life breeds off-field financial success.

    We need to start winning a trophy, or two!! 🙂

  53. Bond James says:

    form is temporary class is permanent, i have no doubt about jack wilshere bouncing back, stronger than ever before come this saturday or the sunday after that vs man utd.

    this weekend is massive, we have to win and win big to instill some much needed confidence before the man utd game (which i reckon needs to be all 3 points for us if we are to finish 3rd).

    maybe Wenger didn’t play Rosicky because he wanted to utilize wilshere’s defensive skills, we will know much more when we have the team news for saturday later in the day.

  54. Bond James says:


    if we manage to increase our commercial income (sponsorship money, naming rights and so on) by another 50 % which is very much achievable, then we can easily be the top 3 richest and biggest clubs in the world….mind you most of the top 3 have commercial income in excess of £150 million compared to our meager less than £50 million…

    what is it that Ivan Gazidis does again apart from selling our best players ? , i wonder

  55. glic says:

    Afternoon Jizzabate`s 😆

    Thanks Total Van Fokker.
    I was in the 99p store when I saw some Anemone`s with the word Hollandia, then ” Mr Fokker ” next to it, so I immediately thought of you !. Not sure about the 11.7 inches though. hahaha


    As for the post.
    Give the boy a chance. the only thing that will stop jack being a £35M+ rated player will be injuries, our best since Brady !.
    Seems like with Giroud and Ramsey before him, us supporters need to have a little bit more patience . The cream will rise to the top !.

  56. Red Arse says:

    Bond J,

    Terry asked me a similar question elsewhere, so I am copying it here for you too.

    I could produce another list, by using different key data, and that would put Arsenal much closer to the first three in financial terms.

    Manyoo took a punt and despite their killing debt, they spent more money on buying top players every season, in the hope that they would win competitions and they have been rewarded.

    Of course it could have gone spectacularly wrong, but their strategy has worked for them, because the players they have consistently bought have brought them trophies which have brought them huge sponsorship.

    The answer to your question is, yes, we can compete with them, but it will come at a cost, and this summer might see the first tranche of that investment, and if successful it will start a virtuous circle of investment producing hugely increased commercial income.

    It needs Mr Kroenke to be determined and not to lose his nerve, if it takes a while to achieve.

  57. Red Arse says:

    Well said the Glic Man!! 🙂

  58. Bond James says:


    agreed, if ever a time to spend big and wisely, it’s the summer of 2013 for Arsenal, all the financial indicators look promising, we’re stable and the only way to increase growth now is by winning trophies – we win trophies we automatically generate more commercial revenues and income, this helps lower or freeze ticket prices/season tickets as well.

    i have no doubt that if we win one Trophy, the flood gates will open and we shall increase our revenues both on and off the pitch substantially allowing us to compete with the mighty arabs (man city) or russians (chelsea).

    we worked hard to get where we have but now we need to step it up a notch and show everyone, most of all our fans that we mean businessb – blimey, it’s certainly has been long enough, hasn’t it ?


    Nice comment BJ, completely agree

  60. glic says:

    Man Cunited are going to get £50M per year from Chevrolet ( like thats going to make someone buy a shit American car because it`s on a c**ts shirt ! ) and their old sponsors AON ( ?) are going to sponsor their training ground for £15M per year ! ( please correct me if i`m wrong on both ).
    Who ever sorts out our deals are f**king shit and should be sacked. Not only do we have some dead wood in our playing staff, we have them in the financial department ! .
    Whether we have trophy`s or not, they ( sponsors ) should be paying for the classiest, rich in history, world known branded club, which also happens to have massive growth potential !.
    As Redders has produced, we are 4th to Real, Man Cunited and Barca. We have fantastic foundations that have been built over the years, some great young talent coming through, so now`s ( Summmer ) the perfect time to back it up with some top notch signing`s to push us further with trophy`s as the icing on the cake .
    It`s time to speculate to accumalate !.


    Spot on Cornwall. Its all about increasing the value of the Brand, and we have untapped potential on that front.

  62. TotalArsenal says:

    Hi Redders 🙂

    Fantastic news that Arsenal generate the fourth biggest income in Europe/World. More than any of the German clubs (even Bayern?!?!?!), Italian clubs and any other English club other than the Mancs. I wonder where we stood ten years ago – any idea?

  63. TotalArsenal says:

    Hahaha Glic – ‘How to grow Poppy anemone ‘Mr. Fokker” 🙂

  64. glic says:

    Being 4th on the Forbes list should have the sponsors tripping over theirselves to get our iconic brand !……..The Forbes Rich list !……It`s like after the Queen, Charlie and Wills…. people should be falling over themselves to get to Harry the Gooner !………F**k me !…..the other end of the spectrum is the Spuds……..with someone like….Trevor of 17A, Bruce Grove, N17…….No c**t wants to sponsor him , not even the f**king Suicide Watchline !.

    We are The Arsenal !. More than just a football club !.

    SORT IT !.

  65. JM says:

    On Man. United,

    They still have the ongoing 13-year deal (started in 2002 and running till 2015) from Nike, worth £303 million (or £23.5 million/year), which also included a 50 per cent profit split from all merchandise sold.

    Both parties have entered/are entering an exclusive renegotiation period, the figure being mooted is a new 10-year merchandising and sponsorship deal is said to be close to £1 billion (along with Man. United getting a bigger cut in profits from all merchandise sold).

    Freaking £1 billion in 10 years ….. Maybe Nike’s chairman/CEO wants a non-executive directorship post(s) in Man. United’s board.

  66. glic says:

    On other news……..some great news…….Disney have confimed that starting from 2015…..there will beea Star Wars film released every year ! . Yippeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeee

    So I`m a Sci-Fi freak !. hahaha

  67. Red Arse says:


    I have found the top ranking football clubs in 2004, the year Forbes started their Football Rich List. It is done by rank, and at that time Manyoo were worth £1.2bn by Forbes’s calculation.

    Teams By Rank

    1 Manchester United | England
    2 Juventus | Italy
    3 AC Milan | Italy
    4 Real Madrid | Spain
    5 Bayern Munich | Germany
    6 Internazionale | Italy
    7 Arsenal | England
    8 Liverpool | England
    9 Newcastle United | England
    10 Borussia Dortmund | Germany
    11 Barcelona | Spain
    12 Schalke 04 | Germany
    13 Chelsea | England
    14 AS Roma | Italy
    15 Tottenham Hotspur |

    Even without all the valuations it makes interesting reading. Look at Barca prior to Spain’s new TV deals gave primacy to Real and Barca.

    Then look at Newcastle in 9th, and you can see you need to take these things with a healthy dose of commonsense. In the interim, Borussia Dortman almost went banckrupt.

    What you can say, Oh Great CloggenMeister, is that Arsenal have done very well to climb that financial table to 4th in today’s very different financial climate.

  68. Red Arse says:

    Actually, Forbes valued Arsenal at $480m in 2004, about £250m at the then exchange rate.

    Quite a change!! Mind you that was pre-Emirates. 🙂

  69. marcus says:

    my starting 11:

    GK-Fabianski/Szczesny (here it doesn’t really matter), Defense- Sagna, BFG, Kos, Nacho, Mid 3- Ramsey, Arteta, Rosicky forward 3- Santi, Poldi, Theo. subs: TV5, Gibbs, Jack, Ox, Giroud.

  70. Red Arse says:

    Real Madrid were ‘worth’ £750, and Barca were $350m, about £350, and £180m respectively.

    It was after that when Barca started to win the ECL and loads of La Liga trophies, as well as the new TV deal. Proves my earlier point about success attracting BIG sponsorship deals!!

  71. marcus says:

    I don’t know why Wenger would rather play Jack when he’s not at his best and completely ignore Rosicky even when it costs us vital points. Same to Giroud and Poldi. I can almost guarantee that had Poldi gotten the chances that Giroud did, we would have won that game. Yet Wenger continues to be stubborn.

  72. TotalArsenal says:

    Many thanks Redders! 🙂

    Wow, that is an interesting list/ development over the last ten years, and yes it makes me proud to see our club moving in the top four (is that also a trophy hahaha?) in that period.

    Now it is time to add some trophies to the financial position.

    I wonder what this list will look like in 2023? And what would be an achievable target for Arsenal?

  73. TotalArsenal says:

    Marcus ?

    Are you pre-matching already?? 🙂

  74. 17highburyterrace says:

    Pardon the long post here….with the time differences and my (extensive, lol) duties, I have to play catch up with you guys….

    I think the biggest issue on display with the Everton result and the hand-wringing over Jack vs Sicky is the fact that Arsenal’s lastest idea—marrying a young (and British) core of players to a group of older, less expensive guys (we’ll put Giroud, for discussion sake, at the front of the list…) is a work in progress. Wenger has a tendency to be very hopeful that his ideas will work out (some call it hubris….) and you can see it match to match. The problem is that we’re under such enormous pressure–in the table currently, but from the fan base paying high prices and bringing even higher expectations, more generally….

    Given 3 matches in 7 days, squad rotation is a good thing and when we’re winning it looks good. Frankly, after yesterday’s result in the West London Derby, I’m concerned that Fulham see us as the opportunity to get something more and I expect a tough match. The first goal will be key so we must be solid at the back. At least Wenger’s gamble with bringing Sneezy and Mert back (and starting Gibbs) paid off with the clean sheet….

    Going forward was another story. We’ve got deep-seated issues with the ability to score goals–against bus parking teams (Norwich) AND on the break (Everton). You would think big balls over the top to Giroud, knocked down to Theo would have been the path forward vs Everton. And it could have been if Everton’s flattening of our speedster had been properly penalized or if he had just done a little better with the ball when he had his chances to run. Much as nobody wants to see Gervinho (in the stadium, or so it seems from the boos….), that guy often does pretty well–at least with his early touches and getting the ball up the pitch. Maybe, being an away match, he’ll get a cameo at Fulham…. It should also be noted that Sneezy’s kicking was as bad as ever and Arteta was pressured all match exacerbating the tough time Jack had trying to run the ball out….Santi tried to help out back there, but (to me at least) it just seems that he and Gibbs have yet find a common language….

    So, Rosicky, Gervinho, Monreal, (Vermaelen, Fabianski) out, Wilshere, Walcott, Gibbs, (Mert and Sneezy) in….2 points dropped. Long term the BritCore thing has merit, mostly as a means of transitioning us away from being a “selling club.” but these guys are (very) young AND struggling with form and fitness. The troubles have been on display all season. That these are our first points dropped since CL elimination, frankly, seems incredibly fortunate (with kudos, perhaps, due for management)….

    My point is that it’s a balancing act and when it works Wenger looks smart. (And when it doesn’t, here in the States, we have to watch Piers Morgan on the FoxSoccer Channel….) What say the oddsmakers on the enormous gamble of the season? That we could have a functioning (and improving…) midfield on the backs of players with substantial fitness issues: Wilshere, Diaby, Rosicky and Arteta (remember last season’s swoon when he was out)…. IMO it has only met bare minimum requirements and we must thank our stars that Aaron Ramsey has found his feet in this part of the pitch. Similarly, our fullbacks (who have substantial ball handling duties in our system) also have suffered similar problems. Younger Jenks has been almost as solid as (the great) Bacary Sagna when he’s been required but the gamble on Gibbs’ form and fitness (poor in the last two matches) was only rescued by Arsene being ruthless with Santos and shoring things up with a deadline day transfer. Going forward we’ve gotten very, very little from these guys, another (huge) issue with trying to beat the better teams. As much as I think a healthy Poldolski (who cannot give us a full 90, btw) would ease the Giroud-is-not-RVP problem, allowing Santi to work from deeper (Xavi style–He’s no Iniesta….) with his fellow Spaniards could also help in the short term. I see why Arsene needs (and wants) to give the young English guys playing time, but (as always, it seems….) we’re desperate for results….

    ‘Nuf said (for now)….Very curious about the “injury” news (coded Wenger talk….) ahead of the Fulham match….

  75. TotalArsenal says:

    True Redders 🙂

    Barca are also a great example what can happen if you build success ala the Russian Dolls principle and be able to hold onto your top talents for as long as you like, and add one or two quality players every season.

    Whilst RM despite being v rich and spending tremendous amounts of money have relatively won little in recent years.

    And I am hopeful Dortmund – now a proper footie club – will knock them out the CL with gusto.

  76. TotalArsenal says:

    Out for a bit. Catch you later Marcus, 17HT, and others 🙂

  77. Red Arse says:


    I often hear or read of fans describing Arsene Wenger as being ‘stubborn’.
    In truth, I usually roll my eyes and just leave them to it.
    But, as it is you, maybe I can ask what you mean by that term.

    It is almost as if AW has an on/off ‘stubborn’ button, and people can tell when he is not being ‘stubborn’ when it glows ‘green’ and when he is being stubborn because the button glows ‘red’.

    Now that scenario is obviously a nonsense — but it shows why I get irritated by the comment.

    In the real world, who is it that decides someone is being stubborn or not?

    In my experience it is usually someone who wants another person to do what he or she is told to do by them, and they won’t – for their own perfectly good reasons.

    Why is Wenger described as stubborn? Is it because some fans are second guessing him, and simply want him to do what they want, or what they think is the best thing to do, or that they know best player to be in the team, at a given time?

    Why would any fan think that? Are the fans more intelligent, more experienced as coaches, or have better information about injuries or the form of certain players than he does?
    I doubt that they do.

    I am, anyway, at a disadvantage here, because I cannot comprehend why any fan with very little knowledge or experience of the day to day exigencies at Arsenal, should claim that AW is being stubborn because he chooses to do what he thinks is right, at that time.

    What would prove to such a fan that Wenger is not being stubborn?

    Perhaps If he did whatever this fan or that fan, or the thousands of them with thousands of different opinions wanted (which is clearly impossible) would that prove he is not being stubborn, or instead, would it prove that maybe he is just a weak and ineffectual coach prepared to bend to the whim of any such passing fan?

    You are a decent bloke, so perhaps you could explain to me what people mean when they use that totally inappropriate adjective ‘stubborn’ to describe our world class coach? 🙂

    [I am not laying all this on you, marcus, but I am curious about why AW should be described like this, by so many fans]. 🙂

  78. rufus says:

    Chelsea are in serious debt, yet their commercial revenue has rocketed thanks to Roman Abramovich’s millions. It’s basic economics you’ve got to speculate to accumulate.

  79. glic says:

    I was once accused of being stubborn by a girl who was giving me a BJ, it went on for ages….she kept pleading for me to take it out her mouth or finish the job, but no, I wasn`t finished by a long way…..she said, ” your being stubborn ! “……I wasn`t being stubborn though, I was just being put off by the massive queue behind me at the check-out in Tesco`s !. Dont people really piss you off when they are behind you in the queue and start tutting !. Fair enough, I was in the 10 inches or less aisle ! hahaha

  80. glic says:

    rufus. as in my previous comment, it`s not always easy to speculate !. hahaha

  81. rufus says:

    I would never claim to Wenger being stubborn, ignorant yes, but never stubborn. He should wake up and realise that the best business model is success on the playing field.

  82. Red Arse says:

    Rufus/Julian/Who Cares,

    To claim that a highly educated, sophisticated and extremely intelligent man like Arsene Wenger is ‘ignorant’, you must be some fantastic, highly qualified and supremely brilliant dude — and only pretending that you are boringly stupid!

    Hmm. I wonder which it is?

  83. rufus says:

    Red Arse answer me this, is the best business model for Arsenal success on the playing field?

  84. TotalArsenal says:


    Another fine comment, and you might have a good point about Wenger trying to ‘implement’ the Brit-Pack at a potentially high cost currently. That is how I saw his preference for Jack again in Tuesday’s match.

    Your comment are so good 17HT that they often just need a title and they are a good discussion post…

  85. Red Arse says:


    I concur with TA, that your comments are worthy Post material. 🙂

  86. TotalArsenal says:

    Redders at 15.29

    Very fine comment and this would also have been a good base for a post!

  87. TotalArsenal says:

    Rufus 🙂

    Tell us a bit about yourself. Where are you based and how long have you been supporting the mighty Arsenal?

  88. TotalArsenal says:


    Last season Citeh won the PL – they also made a loss of £194m. Bang goes the theory! No?

  89. TotalArsenal says:

    hahaha Rufus – pot and kettle come to mind!

  90. rufus says:

    Explain to me why are Man City in Forbes top ten list

  91. 17highburyterrace says:

    Cheers guys….here comes another torrent of spew….Hopefully neither ignorant nor too stubborn….

    Just like the matches or the players or the manager (or anything) the financial lists and “results” can be taken however people want to take them. We can use them to be upbeat about the future (my choice) or to beat management over the head. It’s all about expectations and worldview. If Chelsea win Europe (two years in a row) and do twice as well in the league (3rd rather than 6th) will their fans be happy? Will Roman? Will Rafa keep the seat warm for Jose if he wins the CL and takes a “victory-season” in Madrid?….

    The Arsenal approach lacks the drama of the Spanish (Russian?) Telenovela but can be just as dramatic…. Some of us like to take a longer view but plenty (Where’s AFC today?….winky face, eh) are happy to live in the teeny-tiny news cycle and the click on me media fosters these days. We get news to excite us while precious little information to draw our own conclusions. Headlines are all we read and they can twist us into little knots–if we let them…..

    Our drama centers on our epic here (Arsene) who tries (often enough) to keep it at a high level while simultaneously balancing many things: the need to keep his players confidence intact AND sell a product (on the pitch) PLUS a vision (“hope”…) to a fan base that is paying for the whole she-bang. That’s a lot of balls to keep in the air (I say, even for Glic, et al….) It doesn’t help that the lame-duck, board (not the owner, mind…) keeps talking about the money he has to spend when they can barely keep their pants on for all the money they’ve stuffed in their pockets(!!). The Dein father/son team, as friendly as they might seem, are almost perfect in their off-stage villain roles….alternately whispering niceties into our hero’s ears then holding him to ransom over the good assets….

    I don’t mean to sound like a broken record but we get precious little information about salaries (which are the whole ball-game, IMO) and way too much speculation about transfer fees. Hey, we can get Dzeko on a free!! If we pay his salary, of course, which might make people start to appreciate Giroud (if not Bendtner who at least with his shirt number was helpful in publicizing wages per week)….Speaking of OG, maybe we should be blaming Lucas Poldolski for not staying healthy or being able to run this season, not to mention Arshavin–It seems in the stands is another position from which he cannot contribute…..

    Maybe Red Arse can help me with the numbers, but don’t Poldolski (and Arshavin and now Theo….) cost more (salary + fee amortized over the life of the contract than our French fan (the flames of discontent) favorite?…. Over time, by being able to afford higher wages we WILL get stronger and stronger. My hope is that we get there sooner than later AND stay there by seeing the value in paying (rather than selling) our better players. In the meantime, absolutely nothing indicates Stan is gonna spend any money and it’s all a bit much (for most fans, or at least the one’s who can’t bother to read something as long as this….) to parse. The sad fact is that we have to take solace in being a well run business while enjoying what we can match to match. Not for the ignorant, I don’t think, but (a certain type) of stubbornness seems almost essential…..

  92. Red Arse says:


    I do not wish to be unkind to you. It appears to me that you are, despite appearances to the contrary, a serious Arsenal fan.

    There is nothing wrong with you saying you are unhappy about this or that, or that you want Arsenal to win trophies, and we have been too long without. Many would agree with you.

    Just stop denigrating the coach with one sentence comments, without explaining yourself, or they mean nothing.

    In answer to your question, you are confusing a ‘business model’ with ‘success on the pitch by which you mean trophies.

    By ‘The Arsenal business model’ we mean a policy of running the club in such a way that it is financially self sufficient and does not require largesse (financial contributions) from a rich Russian, or ridiculous funding from the Middle East.

    That does not necessarily mean having to win trophies. the two are separate.

    However, Arsenal is a ‘football ‘entertainment’ business’ and exists for and on behalf of its fans.
    The fans, whatever some might say, will not be happy if Arsenal do not win trophies in the very near future.

    So, the question remains — ‘How do we achieve trophy success, while remaining out of the clutches of oligarchs, and depending on their money?’

    You may have seen my comment above. I believe Arsenal are now in a position that means we can buy better quality players than we have been able to do for some years.

    Better quality players increases the likelihood of our winning trophies. Winning trophies means big conglomerates will want to be associated with us, and will pay bigger and bigger sponsorship money. [Still with me?] This sponsorship money can then be ‘ring fenced’ to buy even better players, and increasing the frequency with which we win trophies, in what is termed a virtuous circle [which means that once it is established, it will continue producing more of the same].

    Now that is what I would like to see, and it has nothing to do with Mr Wenger being ‘ignorant’.

    If you cut out the gratuitous one sentence insults aimed at the club and our Coach, I will be happy to listen and talk to you and explain the financial matters that are always coming up, if you like.

    Is it a deal?

  93. AFC says:

    TA and RA tell me if I am wrong with this idea.

    Ou trophy drought can be likened to a depression. In a depression everyone is scared to spend in the hope of losing what little they have left, like in football where teams like us are scared to spend in case of slipping further down the table as we cost end up in serious debt and end up having to sell all of our best players. However like in a depression I feel the best way for us to end our trophy drought is to spend the best way to get money is to spend money. Obviously I am not saying for us to go and spend 200 million because that would just be stupid but if we spend around 100 million and then win trophies we will get the money back we spent and more. More sponsership deals will come etc.

  94. TotalArsenal says:

    You answer my questions first rufus. Have some manners!

  95. glic says:

    Roof Arse

    ” engaging in the debate “. Total has tried to engage with you ( hope i`m invited, summer wedding ? ), asking , where you`re based ( Bruce Grove nursery ? ), how long you have been supporting the ?.

  96. glic says:

    I`m on the case already AFC !. A bit of Quantitative Easing !.
    Paddy the Greek and Fingers have brought me around £200M, it`s still needs a bit of drying out, but I should be able to get it around Arsenes gaff by Saturday and will only cost him ,£ 100k !.

  97. Bond James says:

    Arsène Wenger has divulged the latest team news ahead of Saturday’s game away at Fulham.

    On Fabianski…
    Fabianski is not back. The keeper situation is similar to what it was before. It is a rib injury. It is game to game for him.
    On other team news…
    At the back everyone should available. In midfield we have a few people to check like Cazorla, Wilshere and Oxlade-Chamberlain. They will all have tests but I hope they should be alright.
    On Tomas Rosicky…
    We have to test Rosicky who was not ready to start on Tuesday. There are a number of uncertainties about our squad but I will sort that out on Friday morning.

    so there you have it, my fears were spot on re- rosicky not being fit and i’m sure someone commented that you don’t put a player on the bench if he’s not fit – answer – Wenger obviously does

  98. Red Arse says:


    I wrote a Post for BK, (I think) on “The Arsenal Board” and how much money they ‘line their pockets with’.

    You raised the question about those gentlemen, while absolving Mr Kroenke, but to answer you I feel like I am going over old ground. But in brief.

    Kroenke is the ONLY man on the Board who owns shares. The others are ‘managers’ and do not qualify for dividends which are only paid out to shareholders. In any event, Arsenal have not paid dividends to shareholders for many, many years — if at all.

    There are only two executive directors. Ivan Gazidis and Ken Friar are paid relatively modest salaries, and in Gazidis’ case an annual bonus, which is normal for the Chief Executive of a public company.

    The other non-Executive Directors, as well as Kroenke, only take out £25K per year.

    This information, like so much else, is all available in Arsenal’s audited published accounts.

    It means your comment about the directors ‘lining their pockets’ is just another hoary old myth. Sorry.

  99. Bond James says:

    man $hity make the top 10 forbes list ? ah, i thought half their team was worth over 250 million, that alone is enough to warrant them an entry to the top 50 on the forbes list.

    yep, if the business model was to spend on the field then QPR seemed to have done a fantastic job of it by getting relegated (almost).

    no brainer really.

  100. glic says:

    Maybe rufus is jealous of the likes of Portsmouth and Birmingham , who won a trophy and then got relegated and possibly Wigan this year doing the same !. I`d be very surprised if any Pompey, Brummie fan would not exchange their Cup for being in Arsenal`s position !. I can only go by the one Brummie I spoke to recently who said the worst thing to happen to them was winning the League Cup !.

  101. Red Arse says:

    Bond J,

    There is a difference between a player being ‘fit’ for the whole game, and one who is only fot for part of the game.

    I have lost count of the numbers of players [of all clubs] who are brought on for 50 or 60 minutes and then going off [this has happened to Jack, recently] or coming on for the last 20 or 30 minutes of a game, because they are not fully fit.

    I don’t know who said ‘you don’t put a player on the bench who is not (fully) fit’, but they are wrong!

  102. AFC says:

    RA, agreed. I would put Messi on my bench even if he had a broken leg. 😀

  103. Red Arse says:

    I am bored rigid with all this unrealistic bollocks about financial this and financial that — for example, Citeh recieved a massive sponsorship deal to publicize Qatar — money for nothing. That might just have something to do with their ‘wealth’ don’t you think!

    Give me £500,000 for nothing and that might put me into the Forbes Rich List too.

    Come on guys, let’s get real!

  104. Red Arse says:

    Freudian slip — I meant £500m not £500K. You see — I am becoming bored.

  105. Bond James says:


    i’m not sure why you would have Rosicky on the bench unless you wanted to change the game and go for a win ? i thought that was exactly what we were doing in the 2nd half – perfect time to bring Rosicky on

    but obviously Wenger didn’t feel he could have an impact on the game hence he brought 3 players as subs (one of whom didn’t make any sense to most of us).

    which makes me wonder, if Wenger is back to his old tactics and wanting to create another Arshavin ? (yep, he no longer is a bench warmer and i take Rosicky fits the bill perfectly).

  106. Bond James says:

    Abramovich also spent close to 75 million last summer and had 8 trophies to play for and win,

    fast forward 9 months – he’s already out out of 7 and in a few weeks will be out of all 8.

    i rest my case.

  107. AFC says:

    BJ, I do not feel you can use Chelsea as an example. Rememer that 75 million was spent by an arrogant Russian man who knows very little about football, players and finances. A experienced manager who has been managing for 20-30 years would have put that money to better use.

  108. 17highburyterrace says:

    No, no RA, you misunderstood my comment….I only meant to say that the board put extra pressure on AW by talking about money to spend, etc.,. etc., which the media twists into a number which then is placed next to a story about a player flattered by Arsenal interest with a modest transfer fee (or one which fits inside the number in our kitty). I realize the board members have made their money already and now serve at the pleasure of the majority shareholder–who says nothing about money (or anything at all–and clearly lets AW take all the heat….) thus perpetuating a conservative financial approach. My point is that, if we want to play fantasy manager, we need to consider the full costs of the player. Very approximately, for example (and my rounded figures may be off….) RVP to United for 22 mil + 200k/week for 4 years = 60-70 million. Giroud for 15 plus 80k/week (over 4 years?) = 30 million Poldoski a bit less fee but a bit more salary (over x years) = maybe a little more. 2 (younger players) for 1 spreads risk. Similar deals over time should win the war of attrition….

    Which leads me to AFC and “Depression”….. In our modern world depression is something you for which you just take a pill? The pill for football fans is called Spenditallnowbuprotrin. Unfortunately you need a prescription from the special doctor who only flies into Dubai or Moscow (or Paris and West London….) for very special house calls. Sam Walton only drank cowboy coffee in the morning and Bourbon in the afternoon. Still, he put a lot of little mom and pop stores out of business. As such, I wouldn’t expect his son-in-law to take any newfangled anti-depressants. Everything in time…. Soon enough the Bradford Cities and (even) the Blackburns of the world will be easier to beat, etc., etc., etc…..It ain’t pretty, so the pill looks even better…. Nobody liked Wal-Mart when it first did it’s thing, now it’s in the country songs…..

  109. glic says:

    So if Paddy the Greek and Fingers brings me around another £300m wet ones, I will be on the Forbes Rich List !.

  110. AFC says:

    Is Arsenal not an entertainment business?

  111. The Gooner says:

    Just dropping in to check up on all you beauties. TA, a well deserved critical article on Jack’s recent performances and I do not believe it invites other posters to go outside of the article to share their opinions that Jack is “overrated”. However, I do believe 2 starts in a week is over-doing it on the part of our “stubborn” manager (RA 😉 ). Of course, when AW’s gambles pay off, the term “stubborn” suddenly transforms into “brilliant”, so you have a point about what makes AW “stubborn”.

    As we are not all walking dictionaries RA, perhaps “stubborn” is the incorrect term to use when labelling our manager’s tactics/decisions. I’m often perplexed with the decisions he makes and honestly would like to see what happens in training/coaches meetings that leads him to start certain players over others. For example, starting Gibbs and Jack two weeks in a row after poor performances vs. Norwich and both coming back from injury layoffs?

    I honestly thought AW was turning a corner when he recently stated that he learned from his mistake in starting Jack too soon vs. Norwich that he had to take the advice of the trainers etc. He then turns around and starts Jack again against a physical Everton side, potentially exposing him to another spell on the sidelines! I’m sure Jack told AW he was ready to play as he is a warrior, but his feet and brain have not quite caught up to his heart and passion just yet unfortunately. Jack’s a star and he’ll be back to his former self very soon, he just needs more time to adapt to the rigours of the game and find his fitness again.

    Then, there is the matter of why he does not decide to play certain players, such as Podolski, Arshavin, Rosicky etc. The reasons for some are more obvious than others, but why relegate a player to the bench after performing well the match before? If there is an injury, just come out and tell the fans. In no way is AW required to be transparent with his decisions, but he becomes the main target of blame when he does not own up to his mistakes or make the “obvious choices” in our eyes (obvious since we do not have the benefit of the knowledge he may not be releasing).

    So then, perhaps the correct term is that AW is not transparent enough or as fans, we feel that he does not take enough accountability for the clear missed opportunities/mistakes based on the visible decisions he made.

    Also RA, loved the Forbes football club valuations that you shared; really puts perspective into how successful and dedicated our fan base is and I agree that we have to win some silverware soon or those numbers could take a tumble, despite our “financial sustainability”. As a global brand, it’s difficult to maintain a sterling and iconic reputation without results to back it up. At what point do we finally transition from mediocrity and transition back to a top club that can compete with any in the world?

    Hopefully, this summer and next season will help usher in a new era :).

  112. Bond James says:


    are you having a bubble ? 75 million spent by a man who knows very little about football ?

    so you’re telling me the likes of :

    1: Hazard





    are signings that a manager with 20-30 years of experience wouldn’t buy ?

    you really do have me in stitches here….mind you we were in for Hazard and were out muscled and out bid – history repeating itself i.e. Mata

    The only signing this man who knows very little about football made on a whim was Torres – mind you , he may not have been 50 mills but he wasn’t worth 15 either.

  113. AFC says:

    17ht, I was reffering to depression in the economical way. Recession is the modern version of the depression. A recession is not as serious as a depression but the principle remains the same. The only way you can beat it is to spend.

  114. 17highburyterrace says:

    BJ, I think we might have (maybe) seen Rosicky if we had gone a goal down. Frankly with the misses by Pienaar and Anichebe (the open header nobody has mentioned….) we were very fortunate that scenario didn’t manifest. Wenger lies (I say….) AND he is not very adventurous with his subs (note, I didn’t use the word, stubborn….) so it was probably a “symbolic” seat on the bench to buck up the supporters. After all, it’s a big (big) downer to realize that your 4th choice midfielder (Rosicky) alongside one of our top 3 (Diaby) is a crock and should probably have been covered by transfer window purchases….Better to play another top 3 MF (Wilshere) even if he’s far from match ready (too)…..

    Parsing today’s injury talk, I hope Jack can have a better match at Fulham…..

  115. AFC says:

    BJ, he has paid over the odds to get these players when a experienced manager could have got these player for less money and probably paid them less in wages.

  116. 17highburyterrace says:

    Of course AFC, just (trying) to make a joke….Gotta use the smileys, I guess….

    Consumer confidence is what you’re talking about to get us out of the cycle of despondency. Winning is what we need. Spending seems to equate. I say it’s the boring salary issue….(and I’d love RA to tell me what the money people think)….

    Gotta run… ‘sbeen fun….I’ll check in when I can….

  117. Red Arse says:

    17ht, and HH,

    You must understand that I do not see myself as a walking, talking dictionary. 🙂

    I write the way I speak, so I take the point that I am perhaps expecting others to change, when I cannot do so myself — which is not fair. Apologies.

    Like you guys, I am often perplexed by AW’s decisions re substitutions etc, and I suppose if that word was used, I would not have even lifted an eyebrow!! 🙂

    Yes — AW can be perplexing! [means: He can baffle me]. How’s that? 😀

  118. AFC says:

    17ht, I misinterpreted your comment. Sorry for that. 🙂

    Rufus, Arsenal football club is a business. Money is involved making it a business.

  119. Bond James says:


    you might be right there but i suspect Wenger to rotate his midfield a little bit by rotating the front 3 (will be a step in the right direction)…we will be playing 3 games in 7 days, so hopefully we can deliver .


    welcome to today’s world where if you don’t pay much more than a players worth, you get out muscled by the likes of man city, Psg, Real Madrid ….love him or hate him, the russian at chelsea get’s what he wants without letting anyone else get a sniff

    Hazard was probably no more than 25 mills, he got him for 32 , if he didn’t then i’m sure man city (who were also in for him as were Arsenal) would have got him for 30 million, so in essence he got HIS MANAGER & FANS the player they all wanted by paying an extra 2 million and securing his signatures – is he worth every penny ? you bet he is.

    when you speak about an experienced manager getting someone on the cheap or less wages then i think you’ve nailed it, an experience manager still lives in the past and is way beyond today’s business i mean football argghhhh potato pootatoo !

  120. glic says:

    Right, I`m off for an hours 5-a-side, it`s a shame you lot haven`t subscribed to GlicPlayer , your missing a treat, I even take my mirror along so I can see the players I leave behind sat on their backsides admiring my footwork !.
    I hope my calf holds out, it`s been as bad as Diaby`s for over a year and half of playing me up !.
    Wish me luck facefookesquers. hahaha


    Have just read the last few hours posts and have got to say, Redders, the last couple of days you have been an absolute star. Batting away the ignorance shown by those who do not understand football finances and taking on the “stubborn” and “ignorant” merchants who like to think they know better than Wenger.

    Those of you with such hubris in your lives be warned. For every fool like Rufus passing damning judgement on you, then magnify that by 10.

  122. Highbury Harmony says:

    RA, perplexing sounds much better to me ;).

    Stubborn often comes to the forefront when describing our glorious manager because he seems to commit the same baffling decisions year after year. Substituting players too late into a game, not rotating players when he should, starting players off-form or ones coming back from injury layoffs, starting off-form players in consecutive weeks, buying players of lower quality to replace high profile stars (more so in the past), deflecting blame at the officials or complaining to the 4th official when we are losing and the other side are time wasting (he looks petulant when he does it imo) etc.

    The list goes on and on (of course I’ve overlooked the numerous positives he brings to the table to prove my point) and at what point do perplexing decisions become routine and “stubborn” on his part? However, as I stated in my last article, I do sympathize with the old man since he is at fault when he does rotate and when he does not; basically a damned if you do and damned if you don’t hahaha!

    We all have the “right” answers about how to properly rotate players, but we also all have the benefit of hindsight. There’s no guarantee that starting a different player over what AW has chosen would have led to success either. Football is a game of chance and the better team can lose or draw on any given day, which is something that the majority of us seem to forget. Being trusted in the position he is, I think we should all give AW the benefit of doubt in his decisions and hope that he can deliver on top 4 again this year and improve the team in earnest this summer.

  123. Highbury Harmony says:


    AW must have read our comments on BK about being more transparent on roster injury/knock updates ;).

  124. jack says:

    jack wilshere is not the real deal im sorry england fans hes a media made player.

  125. Bond James says:

    jack and rufus,

    i smell a rat

    ah, i smell a hammers fan who happens to be a spuds fan in disguise

    trolls alert!!!

  126. Bond James says:


    i’m not sure why you’re still wasting time with the likes of rufus,

    after my qpr and chelsea post, i didn’t see him jump up and down much with any solid reasoning, logic or SENSE.

    TMHT, do you think everton can join us in top 4 leaving spuds and chelsea to fight for europa league next season ?


    BJ, your right of course. I should know better, i will try and take your advice.

    That would be the perfect scenario, but to be honest at this stage i would be delighted for us just to make it rather than worry who else will. But it would be great to see totnumb and chelsea miss out. hahaha

  128. TotalArsenal says:

    ‘Rufus’ had his chance and is banned again.

    Being rude and insulting to other bloggers, and no intention to blog meaningfully gets you banned. Don’t try to come back as you will get banned every single time.

    Don’t mention his name or previous names in any of your comments as it will go into spam. It is the only way to get rid of the idiot.


    Thanks TA, and sorry for indulging that fool. i get carried away sometimes and apologise to you and the other posters on here

  130. TotalArsenal says:

    All your comments have been trashed, Terry.

  131. TotalArsenal says:

    Dont be sorry Terry. I knew what he was like from the start but went against my gut feeling and gave him another chance. So many fellow BKers have tried to engage with him meaningfully and so I feel we have done our best with him. He has nothing to do with Arsenal but just comes on to blogs to wind people up. A disgrace of a human being.


    What, all of them TA? thats a bit harsh. I meant just my responses to “He who has no name, but also has hundreds”. hahaha

  133. TotalArsenal says:

    He just tried to come on again under another name; this time not a middle class one. Ooh he is sooo inventive!

  134. TotalArsenal says:

    hahaha Terry 😛

  135. 17highburyterrace says:

    This is what happens when folks fail to use their computers for porn/masturbation….
    (Isn’t that what you guys mean when you say, “I’m (getting) off for a bit?”)…. Way to go, TA, for sending people back to a happier place….

    (Look at HH, for example happy as a clam with all that time on his back, er, boat, and at the topless beach….He hasn’t quite come round–get it–to thinking Everton was a good point and clean sheet and a nice run out for our young brits and their Cockney-Pole of a keeper, but soon enough….maybe….)

    But back to the (mental) stroking…. I think, esp. in comparison to US sports, the amount of information we get from the clubs is very, very small. We don’t know the value of deals (transfers, salaries) so, in order to draw our “own” conclusions, we use whatever “data” suits our purpose. Do we believe the Daily Mail or Goal.com when they say we are “in” for a player (worth X amount….) or do we believe the manager when he says “no, we weren’t” as that guy signs for Chelsea or PSG? Both sources lie and you have to always run things through your own BS filter. Haters will say you’re an AKB (Arsene Knows Best…) but so what? Part of his job is to take the heat. In fact, it’s the lack of delegation that scares me the most. If he gets run out of town, then what? Steve Bould? Boro the Prim? I see no evidence that the organization is making ANY plans for the moment when AW says, “OK, assholes, you figure it out.”

    Observers of Late Capitalism (as they used to call it….) know that you just have to follow the money. For me that sort of sleuthing makes it interesting and, in the matches at least, you can see some honest effort on display which I find inspiring. There’s also a decent quantity of innocence and tradition (and luck) in the game (and a bigger helping at Arsenal, I think) which a cynical American (me) can enjoy. The game is coming our way (for better or worse…) and AWs Arsenal are a big reason. Overall, the quality and passion are being diluted (my opinion) even as the ticket prices reach for the moon, but that’s how the system works. For many it might all be too much and it’s really all about the drugs (beer, winning, you fill in the blank….)–so off to find a better fix…. It goes down pretty easy for me, over here, on the big screen with my espresso in hand on a Saturday morning (and no ads to watch while I make my 2nd at half time) and I’ve met some great folks when I have been in North London or even here on the interweb (I think)…..

    Enough philosophizing (bucking up)….We’ve still got (epic, season-defining, life and death, etc., etc.,) matches to play!!! And they’re coming as hard and fast as an off-line blogger…. (Only a REAL cynic would call it, “Fulham Away,” and if we can’t win there, blah, blah, blah….) 43 hours and counting….

    Gotta run. (smiley contented face….)


    17ht, hahaha, my problem is to much interweb porn, forcing me into a frenzy. Thats why i react to he who “He who shall remain nameless, but has been named as many”. hahaha

  137. Bond James says:

    so if you fellas are done throwing your hand bags and what not, can we get back to discussing football.

    Fabianski is out with cracked ribs (didn’t take him long to get back on the treatment table, so we’re blessed with the likes of diaby, rosicky, fabianski – the usual culprits never seem to disappoint year in year out)…

    i might be a bit too harsh on fab as he did get a kick (or so we’re told) anyway that means he’s done for rest of the season, i suspect.

    hello to sczny (i’m gutted, yeah).

  138. Red Arse says:

    It was inevitable that you would have to cancel that guy, TA.

    We did try to give him a chance.

    You had no option!

  139. TotalArsenal says:

    Hi Redders,

    Not my favourite thing to do, but indeed there was no other option.

    He will try many times to come back on again, but we keep him out from now on.

  140. Milo says:

    I STILL do not see the need for this article. It reminds me of all the other websites that wrote articles that invited the bashing of Ramsey. Why bother to rate the players from the previous match, and then go on to explain in detail why the worst player is playing badly, or why someone else isn’t playing in his place. It just invites criticism of our players from so-called fans, like the one name guy who keeps switching his bloody name!!! I don’t mind a bit of constructive criticism of our players, and I have been known to have a moan or two about certain things, but saying a player is “crap” or “overrated” because of a couple of bad performances is crazy, in my opinion. If you didn’t want to have comments like some of the ones you have been getting, regarding this article, then why write it??? You, or at least I, knew it was coming.

  141. TotalArsenal says:

    Milo the world outside your window is not free, or easy.

    The issue is that important that it will determine whether we will finish in top-four or not. Will Rosicky return and hit the ground running, or not; or will Jack start again and find his form again, or not?! That, Milo, is a big question.

    If people say negative, or even stupid things about Jack, you just have to shake it off and forget about it. It is not worth your time!

  142. Milo says:

    Yeah, I guess you are right!!! 😀 I don’t get out much, what with doing music and all, and I have never found it easy to relate to others… 😀 I can’t change that though!!! 😀 With music, you don’t have to form too many REALLY CLOSE relationships!!! I play the Viola, and I want to audition for my local orchestra soon, and then grow out from there. I quit playing 4 years ago, after having played for 14 years straight, but now that I’m back at it, I want to do it for a living 😀

  143. Highbury Harmony says:

    17ht, normally I enjoy reading your comments as they offer a well-balanced perspective on matters pertaining to Arsenal. However, I still haven’t a clue as to what you’re talking about in your reference to me on your last comment.

    What does Everton being a tough opponent have anything to do with what I’ve been discussing today? It has no bearing whatsoever…in fact, I’ve only seen highlights so far and haven’t made one comment about any of the individual performances in that game. The background mentions about disappointing performances by Gibbs and Jack were gathered from every match report I’ve read that thought both should not have started, and only served as a recent example of AW’s perplexing decisions..

  144. TotalArsenal says:

    Milo that sounds fantastic. Who is your favourite composer?

  145. Highbury Harmony says:

    Milo, fans will always have differing opinions of players, it does not make them less of a fan of a club if they choose to be critical (in the case of the poster you are referring to, that is just trolling and not a difference of opinion). Not everyone can have as much blind faith as you do, but you’re more than welcome to argue for the player being scrutinized!

    Discussion would not be very interesting if we all had the same opinion. I mean, honestly, it gets boring seeing the same old “let’s just have faith guys, Arsenal is all rainbows and butterflies and there’s no room for being critical or negative after a bad performance!” That train of thought would have more weight if we had something to show for the past 8 years.

  146. Milo says:

    I apologize to TA for saying that he shouldn’t have bothered to write this!!! If people see fit to criticize Jack, then so be it!!! I don’t agree with it, but I cannot do anything about it!!!

    By the way TA, my favourite composer is Johann Sebastian Bach, and he never wrote a damn thing for the Viola!!! 😀 hahahahaha 😀

    I listen to ALL kinds of music…from the Black Keys, to Ernest Bloch!!! 😀 You name it, I probably listen to it!!! 😀 A LOT classical musicians only listen to classical music, which I find rather unappealing, to my taste. If it sounds good, it doesn’t matter when it was written, or by whom it was written by, is the way I see it 😀

  147. 17highburyterrace says:

    Uh Oh….Sorry HH, I was just trying to make a joke about how we’re all happier when we’re getting some action, which is what we all think is helping you take the dropped points vs Everton in stride…. Again, sorry. I was just trying to be funny, but I guess I gotta get my emoticons working better for me, as I’ve also had others misunderstand me today….This internet stuff is tricky…. (Usually I use the three dots to indicate sarcasm or a joke, but sometimes just to move on. Maybe I need to learn proper syntax and punctuation someday….You’re still down there in Miami, correct? Where exactly are you based? Just curious….)

    My hunch is that Jack was the fitter option over Sicky. In my opinion Jack is the shit (as we say….) and if he can stay fit and maybe get a bit of right foot it will be very exciting. I missed some bits of matches this year with my travels but it was very exciting to see him return vs QPR (though that match also required a late winner). The single best bit of football I saw all season from us was the 1st half against Sunderland (away). Anybody who needs to see what is possible with Jack and Santi playing together should watch those 45 minutes. That was also the match where Ramsey, I think, turned the corner and went from disappointing and (dare I say it) Gervinho-esque in front of goal to useful. (The latter problem will continue until he scores one….) Wenger switching Sagna to CB and Ramsey to RB also undermines the “stubborn” tag, but that’s a side issue. If Sicky cannot play then Jack must. As I keep saying, I definitely think Monreal should start over Gibbs just because Santi knows his game better (but AW didn’t listen when I said this before Everton….) It all runs through Santi (at the moment)….ease pressure on him and others can flourish. 9 points from these three matches was always going to be difficult–if we win the first two, I’m not sure we have the quality plus composure to not slip up at the Cottage. Now it’s not about composure but desire. This group should be fighting for their CL lives (collectively, and, sad but true, individually). We aren’t really all that good (my opinion and red herring for future discussion) but we might have enough on this account.

  148. Bond James says:

    Wenger signing praises for big Andy c,i wonder what are the odds of wenger signing him this summer considering he will be available for around 14-17 million, hmmmmmmmm


    i know it may not happen but Carroll might not be a bad signing if we can get him on the cheap, maybe do a player swap plus 10 million…

    we will be 2 strikers light if we get rid of chamakh and bendtner.

  149. Highbury Harmony says:

    Milo, perfectly ok for you not to agree with it! That is what discussion is all about and it is impossible to all see eye to eye on every single matter :). It’s nice to have posters like you who have unwavering faith in all our players, since it’s a good contrast to those who are overly critical of some or all players we currently have. Personally, I’m too big of a fan of Jack to ever be too critical on him, but when a bad performance warrants a less than positive review, I think it’s well deserved.

    However, I don’t think TA was trying to invite negativity or for others to start going outside the means of the article by ragging on Jack’s overall abilities as a footballer. We all know Jack is quality and a burgeoning world-class talent ;).

  150. TotalArsenal says:


    The violin is a beautiful instrument. It must be great to be able to play it well! 🙂

    Is it also a source of income for you?

    My parents were desperate for me to learn to play an instrument and I had a few torturous years of piano lessons. All I wanted was play football and chase the girls hahaha 🙂

    I love Bach too, but also Chopin, Strauss and my absolute favourite Mozart. I only have half a dozen of CDs though and many years ago I did a ‘Classical Music Listening Course’ in Amsterdam which was very interesting.

  151. Highbury Harmony says:

    Haha 17ht, no harm done, glad you cleared that up. I’m new to your comments so I really just didn’t understand your attempt at a humorous “analogy” :). It appeared as if you were trying to single me out for something I never even did!

    The sun and time with the fiance is certainly a big source of relief though haha ;). I’m still in Miami for another day and based in South Jersey for 6 months of the year and Toronto for the other 4-5 months (vacation for the other 1-2 months of the year!). Where are you based? I noticed you have made references to the NA sports market and being based in the states!

  152. AFC says:

    BJ, you are joking about Carroll right?

    HH, I actaully like negative bloggers. They tend to say it as it is and bring us back down to reality when we are over rating a player or getting a bit carried away.

    Milo aka Jack’s Protecter, I am not saying we are getting carried away with Jack, so please to do not grill me. 😀

  153. Highbury Harmony says:

    17ht, in no way was I alluding to the fact that I had more knowledge over AW as to who to start :). The examples of Jack and Gibbs (among all the others) were simply drawn out to prove a point that AW’s decisions are incredibly perplexing at times. Of course, it is all speculation and hope on my part, and I do not have the benefit of the information that AW has that he may not be releasing to us. However, there is no news of an additional Poldi knock, yet for some reason he did not start AGAIN!

    It was evident in the Norwich game that the Gibbs-Santi partnership bore no fruit and in Poldi’s sub appearance (against Norwich) that he had his scoring boots on. If Rosicky was injured and AW insisted on starting Gibbs again, why not play Santi centrally and have Poldi on the left? OG seems to play better when Poldi plays too and the link-up play between Poldi and Gibbs was fantastic earlier in the season.

  154. Highbury Harmony says:

    AFC, agreed in part. I like negative posters who are reasonable and can also understand the opposing view. The discussion that stems from their opinions is stimulating and I often find myself sharing some similarities in their criticisms of the club/performances/etc. However, negative posters who try to force their opinions on you or claim it as fact are a different matter altogether though…

  155. Highbury Harmony says:

    Fiance is finally ready and we are about to head out for a lovely dinner at a restaurant overlooking the beach/ocean. I was happy to join in on the discussion a bit more today since we were on land for the day, I’ll catch you all later :).

  156. AFC says:

    HH, partnerships are extremely important and these often take years to form but Gibbs and Podolski seem to understand each other very well. Maybe Nacho and Podolski are contrasting personalities which is why they are not as effective together. Nacho is more passive and Podolski is aggressive.

  157. Bond James says:


    not sure why i’m joking about Carroll ? if we can get him for 10 million, then it’s a coup for sure…he’s young, he’s british and he has the best years ahead of him, he will certainly be no worse than Giroud albeit our attack may become one dimensional but who said i wanted him as a regular starter ?;) he will be a good 3rd striker signing, allowing us to get a quality CF/ST for 20-30 million.

    have any of you ever thought what won man city the title last year ? if not, then i’ll say this



    ,Dzeko ,


    Arsenal 2014 :

    Jovetic/lewandoski /Hiquain/Suarez/Benzema/Cavani



    i reckon the reason why Giroud has been not as clinical or as good as we all expected him to be is purely because he has no competition at Arsenal not even in training (where it matters the most) , note how Van Puss* said how he got better than before because of the competition from 3 other quality strikers in the squad.

  158. AFC says:

    BJ, Carroll is a joke. He is one of the most over rated England strikers of all time. He would be the worst striker we have ever signed. No Please!

  159. AFC says:

    Giroud is miles better than Carroll. 10 million. He is not even worth 5 million.

  160. Bond James says:


    out of curiosity, have you watched Carroll play for newcastle or watched him play this season for west ham ? and how long have you been following the EPL ?

    i’m not sure where this overrated and underrated nonsense stems from, either you’re good enough or you’re not – we certainly seem to do over do the use of the world overrated – everyone knows all the players who play for England are overrated – if i got a penny for every time i heard it, i be the majority share holder at arsenal and buying Falcao for all you lovely gooners 😀

  161. AFC says:

    BJ, I watch the PL week in week out. I have watched Carroll for England and in the Prem. He is an average no. 9 and nothing more. He has scored some good goals like all average players can. I do not say this about many players but I will say it. I actually hate Carroll. I do not hate him as a person but hate everything to do with him.

  162. AFC says:

    You name me a top team who would want Carroll.

  163. AFC says:

    BJ, the England team is pretty dire and Carroll is one of the poorest strikers who England have selcted in recent years so that is saying a lot. I would take Chamkh, Park and Bendtner over Carroll anyday. Kenny was deluded when he signed Carroll.

  164. AFC says:

    BJ, the majority of the England squad are over rated. We could go through each player if you want.

  165. Bond James says:

    i didn’t ask if you watched him for England, i asked specifically if you have watched him play for New castle ? i don’t think you have hence it reflects in your comments, Carroll is not everyone’s cuppa i’ll give you that but you can never question his work rate, commitment and presence .

    actually if you had said that you hate him as a person then it would have made more sense, his disciplinary record isn’t that great and is a party animal – not players Wenger likes to sign or else we would have had m’vila

    i was only playing devils advocate linking him with wenger, the real purpose of that article was to let all of you enjoy the youtube link at the bottom (has a certain bergkamp scoring goals)

    Re- your question,

    Carroll isn’t daft enough to sign for a big club which means sitting on the bench and not getting regular playing time, so i suspect he will either go back to new castle or stay at west ham…i won’t rule out stoke either (if they survive)

  166. AFC says:

    BJ, I have watched him for Newcastle. He played well for a mid table team like lots of average players can. Cisse and Ba are better than him. To me he is not good enough to play for a top side.

  167. Bond James says:

    that’s what they said about Henry and co before wenger worked his magic.


    you’re only repeating what i said, i don’t disagree with it, however , what would you rather have our tabloids say ? something like this

    “all our players are made to look good because of the quality of the foreign players around them” without these players our players are a waste of space and shouldn’t be even playing football ?

    this is not how it works, every country’s media is entitled to talk up their teams and players, get people excited and sell newspaper – this is what they do for a living.

    Messi is a world beater, maybe the best footballer of our generation yet what has he won Argentina or may i ask, how many times has he carried or won Argentina anything ? so the same argument can be used for him, no ? that because of the company he has at barca, he is a world beater other than that he is overrated ?

  168. AFC says:

    BJ, Henry is completely different from Carroll.

    Regarding Messi, he is one of the best of this generation however I agree that Barca to a degree makes him seem better than he is. I also tell this too all of my friends and tell them that if he came to Arsenal and played in the PL he would not perform as well. For me the quality of players have decreased since the Zidane, Ronaldo era.

  169. AFC says:

    Henry had potential to become a world beater. Carroll has very little potential to become a top striker.

  170. Bond James says:

    everyone has potential to become a world beater, through sheer hard work, determination and a decent manager to guide you through….if players didn’t have that belief or fire to do well at the biggest stage of them all then they wouldn’t be professional players or thriving to play for their countries , let alone clubs.

    it’s incorrect to say that Henry had potential to be a world beater after we all saw him become one, a lot of players have the potential of becoming world beaters ? but do they deliver, hardly.

  171. AFC says:

    BJ, I would take Lukaku over Carroll anytime.

  172. AFC says:

    BJ, we often agree with each other but today we seem to have completely opposing views. You or me will not change our opinions so let’s just agree to disagree. 🙂

  173. Bond James says:

    re- Messi / Argentina and Barca

    tell me which out of the 2 is better ignoring who plays behind them,

    Barca :


    Pedro /Sanchez Messi/Tello Villa


    Messi/Di Maria

    Aguero Messi/Tevez Hiquain

    i think that should do all the talking itself.

  174. Bond James says:

    Lukaku is Quality, no doubt about that (chelsea paid in the region of 17-20 mills, likely to cost more than 20 million)

    but is he better than Christian Benteke ? (could be brought for less than 15 million)

    i wonder.

  175. Bond James says:


    yep, that time of the night for me, till next time, AFC


  176. AFC says:

    Speak to you soon, BJ. 🙂

  177. VCC says:

    Good Morning all fine BKers.

    I have only received one entry (GLiC) for this weeks UMF league. Can everyone get their entries in ASAP please.

    Ta very much.

    ps..perhaps next week TA will update the UMF widget 😉

  178. TotalArsenal says:

    Morning fellow G’s

    New Post – New Post 🙂

  179. TotalArsenal says:

    VCC sorry!

    When did you post your comments again?

  180. VCC says:

    beginning of the week Total.

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